Word of The Witnesses: 12 Monkeys Rewatch Podcast

Beep & CC are joined by Barrie Hardymon of NPR to discuss 3.01 “Mother” Special announcement! Barrie processes her feelings after just finishing the finale... ...and then she enters the gauntlet Optimism in our pessimism True characters & a cathedral of time travel The three keys to a good ending Season 3: 12 Monkeys levels up The two djinns are now playing 3D chess All mothers are important The clues in the plain sight Love & loss The future is Jennifer A shift in the grandmother & grandson dynamic Genre homages Little shit Hannah as Cole’s guardian The greatest danger to Mr. Cole...is himself Something tells me you’re the one I should keep an eye on You have no idea the choices I’ve had to make You’ll do as I say Titan is a stylish nightmare Cassie as a Boticelli Virgin Mary in hell An interrogation of female power An ode to Hannah Waddingham The love you must show is for the man he becomes A cult built on a lie The hands that shape The hero will not save the damsel What the hell are you? Greetings asshole What Future Asshole knows All you & I are ever going to have is what’s in between You’re going to have to forgive yourself 99 Luftballons: Ode to an iconic pop culture moment Rabbit hole: why this song is so perfect You can’t have him The horror of the birth scene A newborn’s cry

Beep & CC are joined by Terry Matalas to discuss 2.13 “Memory of Tomorrow”! Warning: There's a whole discussion about ending a series, as it relates to Game of Thrones. If you don't watch or don't want to be spoiled, skip min 43 - 62.

Beep & CC are joined by Alisha to discuss 2.12 “Blood Washed Away” Terry Matalas is coming back for the S2 finale pod! Culmination of plot, mythology & romantic tension Casserole: love & death Inevitability & free will Gaining something to lose Blood washed away Parallel team journeys of frustration & failure Costuming, cinematography & horror swoon Jennifer is thrown into the deep end of the pool M’am: Our Scav King is evolving The Jennifer & Hannah leadership loop Revealing Titan is an amazingly crazy sci fi moment Why would you walk towards the creepy music? The recurring imagery of the Aramaic clock The end of the Deacon & Ramse story A uncomfortably relatable argument Just two men in a bar The only thing you’ll be wishing for is more time Melinda & Charlie: The Romeo & Juliet of 12 Monkeys You of all people should understand this Cole: Making good on the Lullaby promise Cassie: WTF he left me in a coma?! Casserole’s independent journeys toward healing Where are you right now? Parallels with the series finale epilogue An all time classic tv mythology payoff moment What are YOU doing HERE? A car crash of POVs Through the looking glass I’ve always known, Cole It was so worth the wait All You’re Going to Want Is To Get Back Here Song of Solomon

Beep & CC are joined by Jen to discuss 2.11 “Resurrection” The end of S2 is like drinking from a feels firehose The importance of emotional check ins Different kinds of resurrection Burning the symbols of 2016 Jennifer Cole & his faith in Jones The coup: which side are you on? Coups are about a loss of faith The apex of the Ramse & Cassie revenge journey Casserole: no, come on MY mission Cassie, control & fear Cole & Ramse: a tragic preview of Brothers Debate club: Ramse’s character journey You’ve never been a father I always thought you were my family Don’t You Forget About Me A heart beats within this chest Christ you even sound like him Et tu Whitley? Casserole fight! Self preservation was never my thing It takes one to know one The role of Old Jennifer in the narrative The bravery of Chicken Jennifer Hannah & her mothers Oh it’s personal Brain Burn: Old Jennifer & the Titan choice Resurrection: mother is not without her sense of humor Hello Egg, I’m Chicken Look how pretty I was But maybe if I was braver I love you The bravery of Egg Jennifer Thank you for believing in me That wordless Ramse & Cassie moment Jones goes down with the ship I don’t want to be afraid anymore This could’ve been a season finale Casserole high alert

Beep & CC are joined by Meagan to discuss 2.10 “Fatherland” The many meanings of Fatherland The Et tu episode The high stakes of telling a betrayal story An Ode to Agent Gale The Agent Gale loop debate The Olivia origin story loop A thing in a box The red storms set the stakes now & for the series Three dimensional chess vs. pick up sticks The situation room debate: pros & cons Hope vs revenge and character POV It was just one night You finally fit in around this place The seeds of Deacon’s character journey Luring the audience into the betrayal Loyal to a fault Bottom’s up Cole Agent Gale is another Cassandra I’ve known you a long time I’d hope I’d have something to say about it Berlin on August 13, 1961 We did what we did Save it Loops of fate & chance A man who witnessed the future came to me Dr. Frankenstein & the creature Sometimes you gotta go it alone A crucial moment in our villain’s origin story You will lead us to a world without time My place in the grand cycle ends today There is no we Here it comes Die Walkure

Beep & CC are joined by Meg to discuss 2.09 “Hyena” Meg enters the gauntlet An Ode to Jennifer Goines Why the finale might be the best ever The Hyena Burger t-shirt theory Truth, perception & deception Found family vs. real family “She never mentioned it to me” An ouroboros of mentorship “Pay attention to the hands” “There are many endings…” Like shaking up a bag of cats The House of Truth & post apocalyptic world building The Keeper is a messy bench who loves drama The craziest bonding moment ever: “Same” “Mother says it has some sentimental value...to you.” “I liked the swan story better.” The authenticity of the Hannah & Jones relationship The photograph, Hyena & Legacy: The Elliott Jones Story The tragic story behind the opposing time machines “You may call me Hannah” Titan: “Insurance against the future” “He lies” Jennifer reclaims her origin story Leadership lesson #1: Be a mother, not a sister Discount grenades! Leadership lesson #2: Read the room Another debate about truth The kernels of truth within the fake fight The Pallid Man & the trap within the trap ...within the trap Leadership lesson #3: Learning from failure & reckoning with the price of taking people on “...the right ending is the one you choose” Knock knock!

In this special not so minisode, CC & Beep read and discuss listener feedback for 12 Monkeys 2.08 "Lullaby." Good luck listening to this without crying or experiencing a brain break. There is a prize announcement at the end, so I guess that makes up for it?

Beep & CC are joined by Jen to discuss 2.08 “Lullaby” Welcome to one of the greatest episodes of tv ever An ode to Groundhog Day stories Free will vs. fate We now have 20/20 vision Brain burner #1: Why can’t this plan work? Faith vs. reason “A moment of happiness” The circle of the Jones family saga Holding her dead little hand Brahm’s Lullaby The “undiscovered country” beckons “The answer, Mr. Cole, has been in front us the entire time” Seven rounds of boom, birds, Taps Brain burner #2: What does 2020 Jennifer know & why? “Causality’s Fool” The return of Cassie the healer Fireside chat: faith, reason & foreshadowing “The only world I ever gave a damn about was the one with you in it” Casserole: emotional ships passing in the night Brain burner #3: Who is the real puzzlemaker? “Time is on our side?” The perfect set up for an emotional deluge [This is when we flail about the Hannah scene for a hundred reasons] Parents, children & lost time “I’d rather have that moment...” vs. “It’s the losing that haunts us” Team Revenge Assemble!

Beep & CC are joined by Bubs to discuss Episode 2.07 “Meltdown” Send us your “Lullaby” thoughts! The return of red forest truther Bubs We heart bottle episodes Haunted by the past, literally Horror grounded in science The power of love Reconsidering Time’s role in this episode Olivia’s three dimensional chess breaks our brains It’s all about the climb “Moving Train” This is how you make TV deaths hurt “Where did he go?” Welp. SEXY TIMES! “I like to correct my past mistakes” Red tea & Titan foreshadowing Casserole shipfest #1: jealousy Casserole shipfest #2: “I guess we don’t really know each other anymore” ENTRAILS! The red tea visions & Cassie’s burden Casserole shipfest #3: Wait, MY face? The sociopath & the pacifist Two men doing crazy things for love “You did once and that can’t be erased” “Cole doesn’t have it in him and neither do I.” Cole & Season 4 Olivia have a chat The house of cedar & pine: inside one prison & staring at another... TITAN! Olivia sets the bait Casserole (disconcerting!) shipfest #4: “I know you and you would never let me die” Ramse & Jones: united by grief for their lost children Jones & Cassie: the perfect setup for “Lullaby” The mystery of Sam

Beep & CC are joined by “May We Geek Again” co-host Jo to discuss Episode 2.06 “Immortal” Jo enters the gauntlet How film & television influence our perception of historical eras This episode looks like a 1970s film The many meanings of “Immortal” Cole “Coles” so hard at hide & seek How children view morality We are set up to believe Kyle Slade Moral choices & partiality 1970s films & disillusionment 12 Monkeys: a series of portraits of New York City Welcome to Fear City: NYC during the Summer of 1975 The rise of serial killers during the 1970s Kyle Slade wants to be the hero of this story Pancakes are delicious! Oh, Victoria “You’re about to father a child & change the course of history” The perfect moral quandary for Ramse & Cole A moral dilemma loop The ethics of being a bystander This episode is a study in what factors affect moral choices Detective Damato sure isn’t Agent Gale Cole “Coles” so hard again Your life is not your own anymore Kyle Slade: true & false Olivia delivers the opening argument in favor of the red forest… …and Shaw will deliver the closing argument Cassie & epic foreshadowing “He made it sound almost beautiful.” “Death is everything.” The ebb & flow of Cassie & Jennifer’s friendship

Beep & CC are joined by Aimee to discuss 2.05 “Bodies of Water” Aimee enters the gauntlet, to be continued…. Roadtrips with snacks...and without snacks Future Olivia & Future Jennifer set this day in motion Bodies & water The many layers to Old Jennifer & Cole meeting This what happens when you play God and you don’t know your lines The magical comedy of jealousy Debate club: Deacon’s proposed execution Boys’ road trip! Weapons grade irony The epic return of Deacon Aimee’s Ode to Tom Noonan Witness Olivia & Old Jennifer are playing three dimensional chess Jennifer playing the role of the idealized independent woman Girls’ road trip! Medication, fictional primaries & real world mental illness Olivia co-opted Jennifer’s childhood trauma “Maybe that crazy can help save the world” Casa de Childhood Trauma & the drawings Daughters without mothers The evolving significance of the Word of the Witness Pivotal turning points for Jennifer & Olivia The Pallid Man’s moment of triumph is the beginning of his downfall… ...and the rise of Olivia the Witness This day is a story about corrected emotional experiences of trauma Casserole: important moments for a romantic slow burn Cole is a different kind of sci fi “hero” Symbolic steps forward

Beep & CC are joined by Erin to discuss 2.04 “Emergence” Please indulge our mini-rant at network television The many meanings of emergence Cycles of mercy & retribution Pour one out for Ramse’s other nut Faith, reason & relationships We are all Old Jennifer now The red tea is explained An Ode to Dr. Eckland: a chicken & egg story of intimacy Explorers & finding freedom in being wrong Break on through to the other side The visions, the series finale & the great red forest debate The 1944 loop & free will I Should Not Be Seeing You “A child is something I cannot have” Overlapping cycles of parenthood Questions about the 1971 death of Mantis Olivia, The Pallid Man & faith Cassie, Ramse & Cole: loyalty, vengeance & forgiveness “I want to help….Maybe one day.” Agent Gale is a midcentury Fox Mulder Cole’s emergence as a hopeful leader Jennifer’s journey to find a purpose Wells actually

Beep & CC are joined by Crystal to discuss 2.03 “One Hundred Years” 02:15 Crystal enters the gauntlet 08:25 2.03 One Hundred Years We’re traveling to the past! And damn this show looks good 100 years, gas masks & record players Getting Used to the New Normal All the reasons why Cassie really does not want to “take a ride” Let’s acknowledge that James Cole actually came up with a plan A few minutes vs. two months This James Cole is smooth as heck…. ...but yeah Cole, she is still mad What the photograph represented to Cassie vs. Cole Hello Agent Gale! We forgot that we didn’t love you at first! Loops within the loop Mantis: mythology building & a familiar flair for the dramatic The fervor of the cult of the 12 Monkeys The many layers to the Casserole argument & how it sets this show apart Guess who else can’t “do what needs to be done”? Tommy Crawford & building the mythology of primaries Mantis & Tommy: Casserole celebrity sighting! Listening to the primaries now that we know the puzzle from above The burden that primaries bear Tommy, Old Jennifer, Mantis & free will Debate club: Ramse’s Almost Execution WWII Columbia University & The War Bureau of Consultants “The Liberty Bell March” easter egg “Libet’s Delay”: time, memory & free will A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur’s Court

Beep & CC are joined by Alisha to discuss 2.02 “Primary” Everything changes, Cole: both time & characters “Our fates are intertwined” Otis Redding & the monologue redux The metamorphosis of “not every caterpillar becomes a butterfly” The rooftop: a series of intertwined choices The most awkward car ride ever Debate Club #1: the proposed execution of Ramse & Jennifer You forgot the mission: philosophical & personal conflict Debate Club #2: Cassie & Jones choose to abandon Cole The reappearance of lost sons & daughters Ramse remembers the Art of War The ever evolving story of Theodore William Deacon Cassie & Deacon: did you ship it? I’m sorry you weren’t a part of my reality Daughters who raised a daughter Primaries & the desperation to stop the noise Many acts of mercy Being single isn’t the end of the world...but you two together is Home is 607 I found my purpose So much is different What I am is because of me Saving someone made the difference

Beep & CC are joined by Alisha to discuss the parallels between 12 Monkeys and Lewis Carroll’s Alice in Wonderland & Through the Looking Glass A critique of “new” math & time as a fourth dimension Circular stories with no end or beginning What happens when time is missing? A forever tea party in chaos Riddle me this Caterpillars & butterflies Alice doesn’t “fit” in the Wonderland Time & memory Life is But a Dream