Mountain & Prairie Podcast

Brendan Leonard is a writer and creative whose stories about adventure in wild places have built him a loyal following in the outdoor world and beyond. Whether it’s writing for his blog Semi-Rad, authoring eight books, or making films such as his recent “How to Run 100 Miles,” Brendan combines humor, introspection, and skilled storytelling in an authentic way that strikes a chord with a wide range of audiences. But as you’ll hear, Brendan’s secret ingredient to success in his creative pursuits is his ability to consistently focus in and grind out the hard work, week after week, year after year. • Brendan is an Iowa native who moved West to attend journalism school at the University of Montana. After struggling with alcohol addiction in his youth, the West’s wide-open spaces brought Brendan a much-needed change of scenery and the opportunity for a fresh start. What began as short hikes around Missoula transformed into an all-in obsession with rock climbing that eventually led to writing gigs with Outside, Men’s Journal, Alpinist, and other well-known publications. Brendan is a shining example of how persistence, hard work, and a willingness to bet on yourself can lead to a fulfilling life and career doing what you love. • We had a wide-ranging, fun, and hilarious conversation about his life and career, and we also managed to wander into a few completely unexpected topics. We chatted about Brendan’s “all-or-nothing” personality, and the challenges and rewards associated with being wired that way. We discussed his ability to focus on the process rather than the goal, and how that approach is beneficial when creating or pursuing an outdoor objective. We obviously talked about climbing, but also discussed ultramarathons, specifically his recent experience running a 103-mile race through the Colorado mountains. And as you’ve come to expect, we covered favorite books, films, and a long list of other interesting topics. • This interview was so much fun, and I really appreciate Brendan having me over to chat. I highly recommend his books "60 Meters to Anywhere" and "Make It Till You Make It", so be sure to check those out.. Also, watch his film “How To Run 100 Miles”-- I’ve watched a ton of ultrarunning films, and this one is my favorite. Check the episode notes for links to all of this and more. Hope you enjoy! ••• http://mountainandprairie.com/brendan-leonard/ ••• Topics Discussed 2:55 - How Brendan describes his work 4:00 - Growing up in Iowa 4:55 - Writing for the college newspaper 6:00 - Applying to journalism schools 7:45 - Falling in love with the outdoors in Montana 10:10 - Discovering rock climbing 12:00 - Deep thoughts on booze 15:35 - Soakers and non-soakers 18:30 - Lessons learned from endurance adventures 21:00 - Importance of process over goals 23:40 - The reality of the creative life 24:40 - Story of Semi-Rad 29:00 - The need for a grinding mentality 32:00 - Strategies for the new media landscape 33:10 - Brendan’s creative hustle 35:30 - Focusing on the art versus the bottomline 36:30 - Today’s work ethic versus five years ago 38:00 - Brendan’s daily routine 40:00 - Creating illustrations 41:35 - Other creatives that inspire Brendan 44:15 - Film inspiration 47:00 - Revisiting old work 49:00 - Dealing with reviews and online feedback 53:00 - Managing social media 55:15 - Importance of public lands and conservation 1:03:00 - Favorite books about the West 1:09:00 - Favorite films 1:12:45 - Surprising activities 1:14:30 - Most powerful outdoor experience 1:18:50 - Favorite location in the West 1:22:00 - Best piece of advice ever recieved 1:27:00 - Request of the listeners 1:29:15 - Connect with Brendan online

Jason Rich is a Utah-based artist whose extraordinary paintings of life in the American West have made him one of the most popular and respected working artists today. Throughout his 20-year career, Jason has won countless awards and is represented by some of the most prestigious galleries in the West. But what is more telling is the respect and admiration he has earned from many of his cowboy artist contemporaries-- as you’ll hear, Jason is amazingly humble, gracious, and grateful for his career in professional art. • Growing up in Idaho, art has been a central part of Jason’s life for as long as he can remember. He was formally educated as an artist, and immediately after graduate school, he committed himself fully to painting professionally. Thanks to his focus, work ethic, and the support of his wife, Jason was able to carve out a niche for himself in the competitive world of Western art. Two decades later, Jason’s popularity continues to grow, which is partly a product of his constant drive to push outside his comfort zone and mature as an artist. • Jason and I had a fun conversation, and we dug into the many aspects of his life as an artist, family man, and admirer of the American West. We discussed his upbringing in Idaho, and how he developed the confidence and skills to go directly from grad school to professional art. We chatted about his techniques for challenging himself as an artist and how his work has evolved over the last two decades. We also talked about his association with the prestigious Cowboy Artists of America, and how spending time with other talented artists has influenced his work. We covered mentors, favorite books, favorite artists, and much more, so be sure to check out the episode notes for a complete list of everything discussed. • Thanks again to Jason for taking the time to chat. Hope you enjoy! ••• http://mountainandprairie.com/jason-rich/ ••• TOPICS DISCUSSED 2:20 - How Jason describes his work 3:35 - How Jason describes his art 4:50 - Jason’s childhood 5:40 - Family history in the West 7:00 - Early memories of art 9:30 - Education in art education 10:30 - Decision to pursue art full time 11:00 - Graduate school 12:00 - Transition to professional artist 14:30 - What gave Jason the confidence to pursue art 17:00 - When did Jason know he had “made it” as an artist 21:30 - Jason’s daily routine 25:00 - Jason’s need to push himself artistically 28:55 - Artists that have influenced Jason’s work 31:40 - Humbleness + Discontent 32:20 - Cowboy Artists of America 34:25 - Ensuring historical accuracy 37:40 - Unchanged nature of ranching through the ages 38:10 - Changes in Jason’s art over the last 15 years 42:40 - Approaching art as a business 46:50 - Advice to his younger year old self 49:15 - Favorite books 50:50 - Favorite films 52:45 - Other hobbies 54:55 - Most powerful outdoor experience 56:20 - Favorite place in the West 57:40 - Best advice ever received 58:30 - Request of the listeners 59:45 - Connect with Jason online

Longtime listeners of the podcast will definitely remember my first interview with Jim Howell—he is a rancher and CEO of Grasslands LLC, a progressive ranch management company with operations in the American West, Florida, and New Zealand. Jim was also a co-founder of the Savory Institute, a non-profit organization that espouses the use of holistic planned grazing to restore healthy grasslands around the world. Having worked close to the land his entire career, Jim has a fascinating personal and professional backstory, so I encourage you to listen to our first episode, if you haven’t already. • Knowing that many Mountain & Prairie podcast listeners either work in ranching or are interested in holistic ranch management, Jim and I decided to have a second conversation focused on more of the nitty gritty details of his process for managing ranches. We discuss a wide range of topics, from how Jim and his investors identify ranches as potential acquisitions to their methods for increasing stocking rates while simultaneously improving the health of the grass. We discuss the intense, focused planning that goes into each operation, and Jim explains how his grazing process translates into increased biodiversity and improved ecological health of the entire landscape. This conversation is like a college class in ranch management, only much more fun and engaging. • Our conversation revolves around two of Grasslands’ eastern Montana ranches—the 53,000+/- acre Antelope Springs Ranch and the 38,000+/- acre Cinch Buckle Ranch. My Mirr Ranch Group colleague Duffy Brown and I are working with Jim to market both of these ranches, so we’re familiar with the operations and landscapes and understand the amazing results that Jim and his team have been able to achieve. Both ranches serve as excellent case studies of how holistic management can bolster the health of the grass, increase profitability, and be a true winning proposition for the land, animals, and all other stakeholders. • Even if you don’t have a specific interest in ranches or grasslands, you’ll still get a lot out of this episode. Jim has very wise answers to some of the quick questions that I didn’t ask during our first interview, and he offers plenty of great book recommendations, including one book that Jim thinks every college freshman should read. The episode is packed with great information, so don’t forget to check the episode notes. Jim is a hardworking, curious, humble, and smart guy who has managed to create a fulfilling career that’s making the world a better place, so I know you’ll enjoy the conversation. ••• http://mountainandprairie.com/jim-howell-2/ ••• TOPICS DISCUSSED: 3:00 - How Jim describes his work 5:20 - Overview of the Savory Institute and Grasslands 8:40 - Grassland’s work in the northern Great Plains ranches 10:40 - Traits of successful ranches that are common across many geographies 12:25 - Cool season grasses of the Northern Great Plains 15:15 - Importance of water on Great Plains ranches 19:25 - History of the cattle business on the Great Plains 24:30 - Increasing stocking rates 26:00 - Increasing grassland health on the ranches 27:10 - Techniques for increasing stocking rates 31:55 - Allowing for sufficient recovery without under-grazing 34:00 - The extra intellectual effort of planned grazing 39:00- The hard lessons of experience 39:45 - Specific tools for managing grazing 45:10 - Evolution of mapping during Jim’s career 46:00 - Improvements to Cinch Buckle and Antelope Springs Ranches 48:45 - Ability to generate profits AND replenishing ecological capital 53:30 - Ranches as an investment for a non-ranching buyers 55:00 - Full-care grazing versus owning cattle 1:00:30 - Upward trajectory of both ranches 1:04:10 - What Jim looks for in employees 1:07:30 - Specific books about grass and holistic ranching 1:11:00 - Best book Jim has read in the last year 1:13:45 - Favorite book of all time 1:16:20 - Best piece of advice Jim’s ever received

Brian Calvert is the Editor-in-Chief of the High Country News, a non-profit media organization that covers the defining stories of the American West. Since 1970, High Country News has been fully committed to in-depth journalism that explores complex relationships between the West's communities, business interests, and the natural world. In our current media climate that seems to celebrate surface-level, hastily written news stories, High Country News remains committed to long-form, well-researched, and nuanced explorations of complicated issues. • Brian is a fourth-generation Wyoming native who grew up in Pinedale at the base of the spectacular Wind River Range. A blue-collar upbringing, a stint in the Army, time working in the oil fields, and years spent overseas as a foreign correspondent have given Brian a unique and valuable perspective into the relationship between people and place. This depth of experience allows Brian to approach Western issues with a curious, patient, and balanced style that is becoming more and more rare in today’s media. • I was on Colorado’s Western Slope for work and stopped by the High Country News office in Paonia to chat with Brian. We had a fascinating conversation about the history of High Country News and how its commitment to in-depth journalism is more important now than ever. We discussed Brian’s upbringing in Wyoming, and why he chose to pursue journalism as a career. We talked about his time spent as a foreign correspondent in places like Cambodia, China, and Afghanistan, as well as the lessons he learned from living in such intense and sometimes dangerous environments. And as you’ve come to expect, we discussed his favorite books, authors, and places in the American West. • There’s a lot to learn in this episode, so please check out the episode notes for links to everything we discuss. Also, please visit the High Country News website or consider ordering a print subscription. Brian and his team are doing important work that deserves support from thoughtful, curious folks like the listeners of this podcast. Enjoy! ••• http://mountainandprairie.com/brian-calvert/ ••• Topics Discussed: 2:35 - How Brian describes his work 3:15 - History of the High Country News 5:30 - Moving HCN to Paonia 7:00 - HCN’s non-profit model 12:15 - Current shifts in modern journalism 15:30 - Challenges of producing in-depth news in the age of Twitter 21:40 - Thoughts on the rawness and plain-spokenness of the West 24:00 - Brian’s early years in Pinedale 26:25 - Joining the Army and National Guard 27:00 - Desire to write and see the world 28:20 - Adventurous childhood 30:45 - From college to foreign correspondent 33:33 - Working in Cambodia 35:20 - Where Brian was on 9/11 36:30 - Moving back to WY and working in the oil fields 40:55 - Scary events overseas 45:00 - Adjusting to US after life in war zones 47:00 - Learning to surf and surfing as a healing process 49:45 - Being selected for the Ted Scripps Fellowship 51:00 - Opportunity at HCN 53:20 - In-depth journalism in the era of “fake news” 55:25 - Importance of high values in unbiased journalism 1:00:00 - Importance of considering all sides of arguments 1:02:15 - Role of HCN in journalism for a diverse readership 1:05:30 - Favorite books about the West 1:07:50 - The American West as an idea 1:11:30 - Interesting and weird hobbies 1:12:25 - Poetry 1:14:20 - Favorite location in the West 1:15:35 - Best advice ever receive 1:16:00 - Request of the listeners 1:17:00 - Connect with Brian

Christine Su is an entrepreneur and CEO of PastureMap, a Silicon Valley startup that creates cutting-edge ranch management software. PastureMap helps ranchers plan grazing, track forage, monitor herd performance, manage record keeping, and much more, all with the goal of saving ranchers time and making their operations more profitable. In the business of ranching—one that has not changed much in the past 100 years—PastureMap is a true breakthrough, and Christine’s innovative mindset and infectious enthusiasm are two of the root drivers of the company’s success. • Christine grew up in an entrepreneurial family, and she has had a lifelong curiosity about agriculture and the importance of food production. After building an impressive resume that includes undergraduate and graduate degrees from Stanford, a stint at McKinsey & Company, and experience in private equity, Christine combined her business expertise with her passion for agriculture to form PastureMap. PastureMap makes active or holistic management a more realistic option for ranchers, creating ripple effects far beyond the ranchers’ bottom lines—healthier grass, increased biodiversity, stronger communities, and continued viable domestic food production. • As you’ll hear in our conversation, Christine is a truly dynamic person whose passion for agriculture is matched by her intellect and entrepreneurial acumen. We cover all the details of PastureMap and how she built the business from a simple idea to a successful enterprise. We discuss her personal background and why she initially became so curious about agriculture around the world. We also chat about the ins and outs of active ranch management, and how a holistic approach to grazing can have far-reaching benefits beyond agriculture. As you’d expect, Christine also has plenty of excellent book recommendations related to agriculture, which I know you will enjoy. • For all of you ranchers out there, Christine is offering a 10% off coupon for a year’s subscription to PastureMap, and you can claim it by using the code “PRAIRIE” on the PastureMap website. Check out the episode notes for all the details. But whether you’re a rancher or not, I hope you’ll enjoy this episode. Christine is a perfect example of someone who has merged her passion and expertise into a financially successful business that is making the world a better place. Enjoy! ••• https://pasturemap.com http://mountainandprairie.com/christine-su/ ••• Topics Discussed: 2:55 - Christine gives an overview of PastureMap 5:10 - How Christine came up with the idea for PastureMap 7:10 - Decision to take a break from business to work on a farm 9:45 - The importance of working ranches for healthy grasslands and a healthy planet 12:50 - Explaining grazing to environmentalists 15:30 - Impactful books about grazing 17:30 - Helping ranchers to see the value of PastureMap 20:20 - PastureMaps success stories 24:00 - How Christine expects PastureMap to evolve in the coming years 28:35 - Christine’s childhood and father’s entrepreneurial ventures 30:20 - Goals when entering Stanford 32:10 - Biggest surprise of entreprenuership 34:45 - Of all sectors, why Christine focused her start up on agriculture 37:55 - Heroes and mentors in the ag world 39:50 - Heroes of the business world 42:10 - Life lessons learned from working with agricultural producers 45:15 - Favorite books 46:15 - Favorite films 47:35 - Christine’s hobbies, including jumping in cold water 50:00 - Most powerful experience in the outdoors 52:10 - Favorite place in the West 52:50 - Best advice she’s ever received 53:20 - Request of the listeners 54:08 - Connect with Christine and PastureMap

Robert Krapfel is a US Forest Service smokejumper—a member of the elite team of wildland firefighters who parachute into remote, burning landscapes to control some of our country’s most intense forest fires. Prior to joining the smokejumpers, Robert was a fish biologist with the US Fish and Wildlife Service, where he worked on restoring several species of fish in the lower Colorado River system. You may also know Robert as the husband of my previous guest Jillian Lukiwski, and if so, you’ve likely admired stunning photographs of them fishing, hunting, and exploring far-flung corners of the American West. • Growing up in Northern California, Robert was always focused on pushing himself hard in the outdoors, learning new skills, and establishing a sense of self-sufficiency in wild places. As a teenager, he taught himself to fish and hunt, and early in his career, he learned how to operate heavy machinery while rebuilding a remote government satellite station in the Arizona desert. Robert’s intense curiosity and action-oriented mindset have allowed him to build a life centered around adventure and rugged landscapes, while simultaneously being of service to our country and stewarding the forests of the West. • Because Robert has almost no social media presence, not many people outside his immediate circle of friends and family truly grasp what a unique life he leads, nor do they understand the vital role he played in the creation of Jillian’s blog and jewelry business, the Noisy Plume. Robert and Jillian are true partners in every sense of the word, and their approach to business, adventure, and living an authentic, purpose-driven life can be instructive for couples and individuals alike. They pursue their goals as a team and have sacrificed much along the way to turn their dreams into realities. • Robert is a perfect guest for this podcast, because his career and interests touch on almost everything that fascinates me—the West, adventure, service, creativity, hunting, fishing, travel, conservation, ecology, and plenty more. We obviously cover a lot in this episode, including the ins and outs of his becoming a smokejumper and his scariest experience while fighting fires. We discuss his work as a fish biologist, and how he and Jillian spent a year living in the Arizona desert in a rat-infested trailer. Robert also has a unique educational background, which we discuss in detail. And of course we talk about the creation of the Noisy Plume, and how Jillian’s and his vision for the project has evolved over time. And for a podcast that is always heavy on book recommendations, this episode is particularly full of good titles. • This is a great episode, so I know you’ll enjoy it. As I mentioned, Robert isn’t on social media, but you can catch glimpses of him every now and then on Jillian’s Instagram account, so be sure to follow her at @thenoisyplume. Enjoy! ••• Visit the webpage at http://mountainandprairie.com/robert-krapfel/ for a full list of topics discussed.

Jillian Lukiwski is a writer, photographer, and silversmith who lives near the banks of the Snake River in south central Idaho. Her quiet confidence and deliberate approach to living have allowed Jillian to blaze her own trail, creating a rewarding career and an authentic life centered around Idaho's unique landscape. When not working, Jillian and her husband enjoy the western lifestyle from every imaginable angle—bird hunting with their german shorthair pointers, big game hunting, fishing, running, horseback riding, mountain biking, caring for their farm animals, and cultivating their land, to name a few. • Big western landscapes have always been an important part of Jillian’s life—her father worked for Canada’s National Park Service, so she was raised with a deep appreciation for the outdoors and adventure. From an early age, she was riding—and falling off of—horses, shadowing her father in the backcountry, and building a personal foundation of self-sufficiency and toughness. As a young woman, she applied that ingrained tenacity to writing, photography, and creating jewelry, and has since built a loyal following of admirers and customers around the world through her website, The Noisy Plume. • We had a fun conversation and managed to cover a wide range of interesting topic. We discussed her life path that eventually landed her in southeastern Idaho, and we chatted about the unique nature of that region. We talked about her creative process, how she’s been mostly self-taught in all of her art forms, and how she is able to manage the distractions of social media and the online world. We chatted about the importance of being uncomfortable, and how self-imposed physical and mental challenges can help to inoculate yourself against the inevitable difficulties of life. Jillian is a voracious reader, so we had a great discussion about books, as well as how reading has contributed to her success as a writer. Be sure to check the episode notes for a full list of everything we discussed. • This was a fun and inspiring interview, and I hope you enjoy the conversation as much as I did. ••• http://mountainandprairie.com/jillian-lukiwski/ ••• Topics discussed: 2:50 - How Jillian describes her work 3:20 - Jillian’s home in Idaho 4:40 - How she ended up in southeastern Idaho 7:00 - Description of Pocatello and the surrounding landscape 9:10 - Growing up in Canada’s National Parks 10:50 - Childhood in the outdoors 13:00 - Lessons i toughness learned from her father 16:40 - Jillian’s university experience 18:50 - Jillian’s drive to be her own boss 19:45 - Her early attraction to jewelry 21:00 - First silversmithing class 22:50 - Being a self-taught artist 24:25 - Her quest for original ideas 26:20 - Avoiding social media distraction 28:20 - Daily routines and must-do activities 31:10 - Running 35:20 - Hunting and her relationship with her bird dogs 40:00 - The reality of posting hunting images on social media 44:10 - Why Jillian seeks out discomfort 48:35 - Stories of suffering and benefits of those experiences 50:30 - Advice for those seeking a life similar to Jillian’s 52:15 - Favorite books 56:20 - How reading has affected her writing 59:45 - More books 1:01:00 - Favorite movies 1:03:15 - Unexpected talents 1:04:30 - Most powerful experience in the outdoors 1:06:45 - Favorite location in the West 1:09:20 - Biggest challenge facing the West 1:12:00 - Jillian’s request of the listeners 1:12:59 - Connect with Jillian online

Matt Barber and Joel Doub are the owners of Tom Morgan Rodsmiths, a Bozeman-based fly rod company known for its unyielding commitment to quality, craftsmanship, and enduring performance. The duo purchased the company in early 2017 from Tom Morgan, a fly fishing legend who, along with his wife Gerri, built the company into one of the world’s most unique and renowned rod builders. Rather than focus on the latest fads or selling a high volume of products, Tom was dedicated solely to building the highest quality rod, one that could be passed on from generation to generation, decade after decade. • You may be surprised to learn that Matt and Joel are not fishing industry veterans—their previous careers were in education and medical device sales, respectively. But when Tom Morgan decided to sell the company, Matt and Joel’s passion for fly fishing, their willingness to learn from the best, and their commitment to continuing the company’s legacy allowed them to stand out from the crowd of competing buyers. To everyone’s dismay, Tom passed away unexpectedly soon after the sale of the company, but only after imparting his wisdom, craftsmanship secrets, and high standards to Matt and Joel. Building on Tom and Gerri’s rock-solid foundation, the company is now entering its next phase, and the future has never looked brighter. • Matt and Joel were in Denver for the annual Fly Fishing Show, so we met up to chat about the company and their journey into fly fishing entrepreneurship. We talked at length about Tom and his laser-like focus on quality, and how he was willing to snap a rod in half if it did not meet his high standards. We chatted about the “secret” to making these rods, which mostly boils down to being willing to work harder than anyone else. We talk about Tom’s unique partnership with his wife Gerri, and how the couple went about transferring decades of knowledge and experience to Matt and Joel. We discuss the company’s unique business model, and how it flies in the face of most mainstream, MBA business theories. And as usual, we discuss favorite books, films, crazy outdoor experiences, and plenty more. • This was a very fun conversation, and I’m excited to watch the company continue to grow and thrive under Matt and Joel’s ownership. Be sure to check out the episode notes for everything we discuss, and follow Tom Morgan Rodsmiths on Instagram and other social media. Enjoy! ••• http://mountainandprairie.com/tom-morgan-rodsmiths/ ••• Topics Discussed: 3:00 - How Matt and Joel describe their work 3:25 - Their professional backgrounds 4:50 - Overview of Tom Morgan Rodsmiths 6:40 - How Tom and Gerri and began building rods 7:20 - Tom and Gerri’s first time building a rod 8:15 - Tom’s quest for a “perfect fly rod” 9:50 - Specifics on Tom Morgan custom rods 13:00 - Why the rods do not have fancy names 14:30 - The “secret” to Tom Morgan rods 17:40 - TMR’s business model 20:45 - Why they purchased an “unconventional” business 23:50 - How they’ve been received as the new owners 26:55 - How the Tom Morgan philosophy has carried over into other parts of life 29:15 - Their history as “makers” 32:30 - Thoughts on life in Bozeman 36:20 - The process of buying the business 40:00 - What Tom and Gerri like about Matt and Joel 42:30 - Tom’s unexpected passing 43:40 - Gerri’s influence on the company and Matt and Joel 46:15 - On being embraced by the industry after Tom’s death 48:00 - “The O’Dell,” Casting for Recovery, and Duke Beardsley 55:30 - Future of the business 1:00:30 - Favorite books 1:05:20 - Most powerful experience in the outdoors 1:08:10 - Favorite location in the West 1:10:00 - Best advice ever received 1:11:20 - Request of the listeners 1:13:15 - Matt asks Ed a question! 1:16:00 - Connect with Tom Morgan Rodsmiths

Cate Havstad is a hat maker and farmer based in central Oregon whose abundant curiosity, creativity, and love of place have allowed her to transform her passions into a full-time and fulfilling career. As a hat maker, Cate’s unique style and unwavering commitment to quality have attracted customers ranging from music stars like Gillian Welch to hard-working ranchers and farmers throughout the American West. As a farmer, Cate and her partner are deeply committed to regenerative agriculture and the positive impact that their local efforts can have on a global scale. It’s safe to say she’s living a life guided by purpose and passion. • Born and raised in northern California, Cate was a driven athlete in her youth, as evidenced by her desire to be the first woman to play in the NBA (that’s the NBA, not the WNBA). As a young woman, a fortuitous series of events landed her in a hat maker’s workshop, where she applied that same focus and drive toward learning the craft of hat making. After accumulating experience and confidence as an apprentice, she struck out on her own and now creates some of the most sought-after, stylish, and functional hats on the market today. Cate’s life and work are closely connected to the landscape of central Oregon, and her other job as an organic farmer has given her a deep understanding of the role that regenerative agriculture can play in conservation, community building, and reversing climate change. • As you’ll hear in our conversation, Cate is extremely curious, well-read, and and knowledgeable on a wide range of subjects. We talk about her journey as a hat maker, and how she cultivates creativity and consistent production in a world filled with an increasing number of distractions. We discuss regenerative agriculture and how many people, including well-meaning environmentalists, don’t fully understand the importance of farmers and ranchers in the conservation movement. Cate is a devoted meditator and runner, so we talk about how both of those practices have improved her creativity and outlook. We also chat about Wendell Berry, Michael Pollan, Steven Pressfield, and how those authors’ works have impacted her life. There’s a lot to learn in this episode. • This was a fun conversation that could have continued for hours. Be sure the check the episode notes for links to everything we discussed—it’s a long list! Hope you enjoy! ••• http://mountainandprairie.com/cate-havstad/ ••• Topics Discussed: 2:55 - How Cate describes her work 3:45 - How Cate began making hats 6:00 - Connection to music 6:50 - Cate’s childhood and early influences 8:20 - Leaving college to go on tour 10:25 - New influences of creative people 12:30 - Cate’s parents’ opinion of her taking a break from school 13:45 - Returning to school 15:00 - Goal of becoming a trail guide in Oregon 15:40 - Working as a hat making apprentice 17:40 - Cate’s decision to strike out on her own 20:50 - Advantages of working on simple equipment 22:10 - When Cate knew she could make a full-time career of hat making 24:40 - Havstad Hat Co fans, including Lyle Lovett 28:15 - Process oriented versus goal oriented 30:00 - Cate’s methods for cultivating creativity and her business 31:40 - Thoughts on Pressfield’s “War of Art” 33:45 - Cate’s meditation practice 40:00 - How teaching workshops has influenced her work 43:20 - How Central Oregon influences her work 45:20 - Experiences running in Central Oregon 47:00 - Cate’s experience farming 48:10 - Wendell Berry discussion 50:30 - Agricultural as a vital part of conservation 57:00 - Good books on connection to land 59:30 - Balancing social media and mindful living 1:07:40 - Favorite books 1:09:15 - Favorite documentaries 1:10:15 - Surprising activity 1:11:05 - Favorite location in the West 1:12:20 - Best advice ever received 1:13:20 - Request of the listeners 1:15:20 - Connect with Cate online

Sarah King is a rancher, conservationist, wife, and mother of two who lives and works on her family’s 55,000-acre cattle ranch in southern Arizona’s Altar Valley. The King's Anvil Ranch was established in 1895 and has operated successfully within their family for generations, setting an example of how to run a financially viable agricultural business, while simultaneously protecting the long-term ecological health of their vast desert ranch. The Kings understand that in order for their business to thrive, the land must thrive, and they are leaders in pursuing a variety of outside-the-box land stewardship techniques, including the focused use of prescribed fires. • The King family spearheaded the creation of the Altar Valley Conservation Alliance, a cutting-edge land conservation organization that collaborates with a wide range of stakeholders, including private landowners, ranchers, government entities, conservation non-profits, and environmental advocacy groups. Thanks to focused, diligent efforts over the course of two decades, the AVCA has managed to bring together groups that have historically been at odds, allowing them to focus on shared goals and creative solutions to complicated challenges, rather than dwelling on their differences. As you’ll hear Sarah explain, AVCA understands that open, honest, face-to-face communication has been the key to tackling the Altar Valley’s complex challenges, and their success gives me hope that other organizations throughout the West can adopt their approach and enjoy the same success. • This was a very enlightening episode for me, because I personally just don’t know enough about the landscapes and heritage of the deep southwest. We dig into many of the details of the King's Anvil Ranch and its operation, including the unique climate and ecology of the Arizona desert. Sarah explains how the AVCA came to be, and offers some insights into exactly what they do and how they’ve managed to have such success. We discuss Sarah’s personal background, specifically how an east coast native ended up on an expansive cattle ranch in Arizona. We talk about the benefits of raising children on a ranch, and the lessons she hopes to impart as they grow up closely connected to the land. Given that the ranch is located less than 40 miles from the Mexico border, we discuss how illegal border crossings have a significant effect on the ranch’s operations. And, of course, we discuss favorite books and documentaries, with links to everything in the episode notes. • I had such a great time chatting with Sarah, and I walked away from the conversation with a much deeper understanding of ranching, conservation, and life in the American southwest. She and her colleagues at AVCA are doing important, groundbreaking conservation work, so I encourage you to follow them and learn from their efforts. Also, be sure to follow Sarah on Instagram—on top of everything else, she’s a talented photographer, too. Enjoy! ••• http://mountainandprairie.com/sarah-king/ ••• Topics Discussed: 3:30 - How Sarah describes her work 4:10 - King’s Anvil Ranch 5:20 - History of the ranch 7:10 - Details on the ranching operation 10:30 - History of Altar Valley Conservation Alliance 13:15 - Events leading to the Alliance’s formation 16:30 - Importance of fire in the Altar Valley 20:00 - Examples of AVCA collaborative projects 25:20 - Why has AVCA been able to be successful where others have not? 31:15 - The importance of private land in the West 35:30 - How Sarah ended up in the west, working in ranching 39:00 - Sarah’s college thesis on women dude ranchers 41:15 - Realities of moving West from the east coast 42:30 - Benefits of raising children on a ranch 47:15 - Illegal immigration and its effects on the King’s ranch 55:50 - Favorite books 57:55 - Favorite documentaries 1:00:30 - Most powerful experience in the outdoors 1:03:30 - Best advice ever received 1:05:00 - Sarah’s request of the listeners 1:06:00 - Connect with Sarah online

Charles Post is an academically trained ecologist with a gift for communicating complex and sometimes emotionally charged issues in a thoughtful manner to diverse audiences. Whether he’s discussing the intricacies of ranch management, the ecological implications of ethical hunting, or controversies surrounding the BLM’s wild mustang program, Charles has honed his ability to consider all sides of issues, then educate the public in a style that is positive, comprehensive, and intellectually honest. His academic credentials, combined with his photography, writing, filmmaking, and popular social media channels have made Charles a rising star in the world of conservation. • Born and raised in northern California, Charles has enjoyed a deep connection with Western landscapes for as long as he can remember. He grew up hunting, fishing, and exploring the seascapes and mountain ranges of the West Coast, then earned both a Bachelors and Masters in ecology from UC Berkeley. After considering pursuing a PhD followed by a career in academia, Charles changed course and pursued a less traditional track that melded his two passions of science and storytelling. Since then, he has settled in Bozeman, Montana where he works on a wide range of projects that all tie back into conservation and stewardship in the American West. • Charles and I talked for well over an hour, and could’ve easily continued for several more. We discuss his recent work for Filson covering Ranchlands, a progressive, forward-thinking ranching operation in southern Colorado. We also chat about the ecological importance of ranching for Western landscapes and the progress that Charles has made trying to change some of the unfounded negative impressions of ranching and livestock. We talk about his recent elk hunt, and how that adventure was one of the richest, most meaningful experiences of his life. Charles speaks fondly about his relationship with Ben Masters, who helped him break into the filmmaking world. It also turns out that we have a shared love of the American Dipper (which is a bird, for those of you out of the loop), and we nerd out on that subject for a few minutes. As usual, we discuss favorite books, films, and the best advice he’s ever received. • If you’re a long-time listener, you will love this episode… and if you’re brand new, I hope you will, too! Be sure to check out Charles on Instagram at charles_post and check the episode notes for everything we discuss. Enjoy! ••• http://mountainandprairie.com/charles-post/ ••• TOPICS DISCUSSED 3:00 - Charles’s introduction to Ben Masters 5:10 - How Charles describes his work 6:30 - Why Charles identifies as an ecologist 8:50 - Science versus communicating to the mainstream 10:30 - Charles experience with Ranchlands and thoughts on ranching 17:45 - How Charles tells the ranching story 20:45 - Resources for learning more about ranching 21:55 - Discussion about wolves' effects on Yellowstone 24:35 - Where Charles grew up 25:50 - Charles’ connection to Gifford Pinchot 29:40 - Hunting from a conservation perspective 32:25 - Modern Huntsman 35:15 - Interplay between public and private land 41:40 - How science shaped his ability to be objective 43:40 - His approach to social media 49:45 - The importance of Charles’s sponsors and supporters 54:30 - Charles’s personal history with hunting 1:01:40 - Favorite books 1:08:10 - Weird habits and quirks 1:09:30 - American Dipper nerd-fest 1:12:20 - Most powerful experience in the outdoors 1:16:00 - Best advice he’s ever received 1:19:25 - Charles’s request of the listeners 1:20:50 - Connect with Charles online

Mark Maggiori has taken the western art scene by storm with his dramatically realistic paintings of cowboys, horses, landscapes, and scenes from the American West. But painting is only a small part of Mark’s journey as a professional artist—he is also an accomplished director, filmmaker, drawer, photographer, and musician, working for companies like Disney as an illustrator and fronting a major-record-label rock band. To make his story even more interesting, Mark was born and raised in France, and is a relative newcomer to the western United States. • When he was 15, Mark took a road trip across America with his adventurous uncle, igniting his passion for Western landscapes and planting the seed of his western art career that would flourish two decades later. Between then and now, he has demonstrated an uncanny ability to dive headfirst into a wide array of artistic endeavors with single-minded focus and work ethic, enjoying success at every level. At little over three years ago, at age 36, all of Mark’s talents and experiences melded together when he decided to try and paint his first cowboy. In what he describes as an epiphany, Mark immediately knew he had found his true identity as an artist. • Mark and I had a fun conversation. We talk about all the stages of his prolific career as an artist, and how he has approached each one with a laser-like focus and uncompromising work ethic. Mark explains how he discovered his talent for drawing—a talent that he had no idea he possessed until after he had enrolled in art school. We also chat about how being new to America has afforded him a fresh perspective on the people and landscapes of the American West, a perspective that shines through in his paintings. He gives details on his workman-like approach to painting and ensuring the historical accuracy of his work, and how exercise helps to fuel his creativity and work ethic. As usual, we cover favorite books, documentaries, and the craziest thing that’s ever happened to him in the outdoors, which is a ridiculous and pretty damn scary story! • Be sure to check out the webpage for links to all of Mark’s work, his upcoming solo show, and everything we discuss in this episode. Hope you enjoy! ••• http://mountainandprairie.com/mark-maggiori/ ••• Topics Discussed 3:00 - How Mark describes his work 5:11 - Growing up in France 6:30 - Road trip across America 11:20 - Mark’s interests as a teenager 12:40 - The attraction to art school 15:40 - Discovering his talent for art 18:45 - Learning work ethic 20:30 - Working for Disney 22:45 - Working in music videos 23:45 - Performing music and creating art 24:30 - Mark’s time with Pleymo 27:25 - Leaving music 32:00 - Coming to America to make a film 35:40 - Demolition derbies and rodeos 36:50 - Starting to paint cowboys 41:00 - Building his following through Instagram and networking 44:00 - Expanding to new galleries 45:00 - Secret of painting clouds 47:55 - Keeping his work accurate 50:00 - Starting to paint Native Americans 54:30 - Mark’s daily routine 58:45 - Favorite books 1:01:00 - Favorite documentaries 1:02:30 - Favorite place in the West 1:03:50 - Most powerful experience in the outdoors 1:05:30 - Getting chased by crazy people in Louisiana 1:10:15 - Mark’s request of the listeners 1:12:50 - Connect with Mark online and learn about his upcoming art show

If you’ve been listening to the podcast for a while, then surely you’ll remember Tyler Sharp. He’s the creative director, photographer, and writer who has explored everywhere from east Africa to Montana’s Paradise Valley and has the stories and images to prove it. He currently works with some of the biggest brands in the outdoor industry, such as Filson and Yeti, helping them to tell authentic and engaging stories. Tyler’s first podcast episode has been one of my most popular—we went deep, covering everything from big-game hunting to kung fu to conservation—so I wanted to have him back to continue the conversation and discuss his latest project, Modern Huntsman. • Modern Huntsman is a biannual publication and online forum for conservationists, creatives, and outdoor enthusiasts. If you enjoy this podcast and my guests’ depth of thinking on topics related to the natural world, then you’re going to love Modern Huntsman. Through thoughtful writing, captivating photography, and elegant design, Tyler and his all-star team intend to improve the perception of hunting in our society by highlighting its thoughtful and conservation-focused aspects, which are often ignored by established media. • I like to hunt, although I’m not obsessed with it like I am with endurance sports. But my work in conservation and deep reading of natural history have given me a firsthand appreciation for the importance of hunting, and the vital role it plays in conserving landscapes and species around the world. Without the efforts of visionary hunters like Theodore Roosevelt, the healthy wildlife populations we enjoy here in the American West would be a mere fraction of what they are today, if they existed at all. Thanks to their deep respect for wildlife born from their love of the sport of hunting, TR and his contemporaries set in motion a conservation ethic that continues to grow and evolve. Now, over 100 years later, Modern Huntsman will carry that ethic forward. • Once again, Tyler and I had a wonderful conversation, and I was incredibly impressed with his ability to discuss complex, sometimes emotionally charged issues in a respectful, intelligent, and non-arrogant tone. Of course we discussed the details of Modern Huntsman, its origins, and why there is a need for such a publication. We chatted about Modern Huntsman’s current Kickstarter campaign, which I highly recommend you support—links are in the notes. We also talked in depth about some of the misconceptions around hunting and specifics about why hunting is so important for conservation throughout the world. And just like last time, Tyler had some excellent book recommendations. • This was a fun and enlightening conversation, so I hope you enjoy. Check out the episode notes for links to everything, and be sure the check out the Modern Huntsman Kickstarter page, watch the film, and support the project. ••• http://www.bit.ly/modernhuntsman http://mountainandprairie.com/tyler-sharp-2/ ••• TOPICS DISCUSSED 3:30 - How Tyler describes his work 6:10 - Modern Huntsman overview 8:40 - Improving hunting’s image 10:00 - Modern Huntsman as “new media” 12:00 - Tyler’s relationship with Simon Roosevelt 14:30 - Modern Huntsman’s target audience 16:30 - Misunderstandings surrounding hunting 20:30 - Modern Huntsman’s strategy for telling the correct story 22:00 - importance of having a woman’s perspective 23:20 - Engaging with non-hunters 26:15 - Esthetics of the magazine 31:00 - List of the editors and contributors 34:50 - History of hunting and conservation 39:00 - Tools for connecting conservation and hunting 43:00 - How safari companies contribute to conservation in Africa 47:50 - The Kickstarter film 50:15 - Tyler’s favorite hunting books 58:10 - Best advice Tyler’s ever received 59:30 - Connect with Modern Huntsman online

Scott Slusher is an Oklahoma native and Texas-based photographer who is best known for his stunning images of cowboys and life on working ranches. After seeing Scott’s work, it is crystal clear that he has a deep understanding of the ranching lifestyle and has invested more than his share of time out in the heat and dust, on horseback or in the branding pen. Given his immersion in the tough, hard-nosed world of ranching, you may be surprised to learn that Scott was trained as a fashion photographer and still works with a variety of big-name companies on their fashion and clothing line spreads. • So what allows Scott to have success in two worlds as diametrically opposed as ranching and fashion? Well, as you’ll hear in this interview, Scott has a habit of pursuing his interests with a single-minded intensity and curiosity, unafraid of getting in over his head, venturing outside his comfort zone, or working harder than expected. Combine those traits with endless energy and a knack for making friends with everyone he meets, and you’ll understand how Scott has managed to work his way onto iconic ranches, riding alongside and photographing some of the best ranch hands in the business. • Scott’s enthusiasm and love of people really come through in our conversation, so I know you’ll enjoy it. We talk about his childhood in Oklahoma and how his father’s work as a veterinarian and horse breeder shaped his outlook. We chat about his time as a photography intern and how he chose to dive head first into no-fun chores (like mopping the floor), and how that optimistic, high-energy approach has paid off time and again throughout his career. We also discuss how he broke into photographing cowboys, and how his respectful approach has allowed him to be accepted by ranch hands throughout the West. We cover a ton, so check out the episode notes for a full list of topics and links. • If you don’t already, be sure to follow Scott on Instagram at @slusherphoto—if you love the West and the ranching lifestyle, I can guarantee you’ll love his work. Hope you enjoy this episode. ••• ••• TOPICS DISCUSSED 2:45 - How Scott describes his work 4:50 - Where Scott grew up 8:30 - Time working at a vet clinic 12:00 - Applying to art school in Dallas 14:00 - Finding focus in art school 18:00 - Work ethic during his first internship 22:30 - First time taking photos of cowboys 26:00 - Making folks feel comfortable during photo shoots 27:20 - How he broke into the cowboy culture 33:00 - Working at the Four 6s Ranch 36:15 - Importance of networking 40:00 - Close calls during ranch photography 44:45 - Close call during a rodeo 49:30 - Importance of social media in Scott’s career 1:04:00 - Important books 1:09:00 - Favorite films 1:14:00 - Words of advice to the listeners 1:15:00 - Connect with Scott online

Duke Beardsley was well on his way to a career in medicine, when, just before med school, he took a hard turn onto a new path when he decided to pursue art as a full-time vocation. Since then, he has become one of the West’s most revered artists, producing paintings of cowboys, anglers, and the Western way of life in a style that is uniquely his own. His work is big, bold, and completely original, and it continues to grow and evolve in ways that surprise even Duke himself. • Thanks to a childhood spent between Denver and his family’s eastern Colorado ranch, Duke has been immersed in cowboy culture for as long as he can remember. He has been drawing non-stop since he could hold a crayon, and as a child (sometimes to the dismay of his parents) he demonstrated a proclivity for sketching western scenes on the walls of his family’s home. Duke is also a committed conservationist with a deep devotion to preserving the West’s landscapes and heritage. This eclectic mix of experiences and interests, combined with a formal art education, allows Duke to produce works that are ambitious, inspiring, and engaging. • I stopped by Duke’s Denver studio earlier this week, where we had a fun and wide-ranging conversation. We chat about his decision to change his career goal from medicine to art, and the value he gleaned from a formal art education. He explains that life-long obsession with drawing on walls, and he tells some stories about how, as an adult, drawing on walls has led to surprising professional opportunities. We talk about his artistic process, his meditation practice, and how he managed his extroverted personality in the solitary world of creating art. He also discusses why land conservation is an issue that is so near and dear to his heart, and offers up some excellent book recommendations. • This was a lot of fun and I really appreciate Duke inviting me into his studio. Be sure to check the episode notes for links to everything we discuss, and check out Duke on Instagram, Facebook, and his website. ••• http://mountainandprairie.com/duke-beardsley/ ••• TOPICS DISCUSSED 2:40 - How Duke describes his work 3:30 - Growing up between Denver and eastern Colorado 5:15 - Artistic energy in Duke’s family 6:30 - Duke’s early path toward medicine 8:30 - Transition to art school 9:40 - Biggest lesson learned from art school 12:20 - Focusing his art on horses and the West 14:20 - Life post-art school 15:30 - How Duke’s art is different now from 20 years ago 18:30 - Drawing on the wall 20:20 - Why Duke paints big pieces 21:31 - Story behind Duke’s line ups 24:45 - Getting in “the zone” while painting line ups 26:40 - Working on multiple pieces at once 27:50 - Working with galleries 29:00 - Process for commissioned paintings 31:45 - Extrovert or Introvert? 34:30 - Duke’s artistic process 38:00 - Duke’s meditation practice 41:00 - Drawing on the wall at Las Pampas Lodge 44:00 - Working with Fishpond 45:50 - Passion for land conservation 49:30 - Favorite books 52:34 - Favorite films 54:00 - Surprising activities 54:45 - Most powerful outdoor experience 57:00 - Favorite place in the West 58:40 - Best peice of advice ever recieved 59:45 - Duke’s request of the listeners 1:00:30 - Connect with Duke online