Summary: KMO and Olga caught a ride home from the Psymposium 2014 conference with Joshua Wickerham of the Ethnobotanical Stewardship Council, and the three of them stopped in Connecticut to have lunch with Joshua's good friend, contemplative scientist Katherine MacLean. The conversation covers a lot of ground, including the place of meditation in preparing for the abyss of human suffering that would result from the collapse or severe contraction of industrial civilization, the potential dangers of meditation, finding how to be of service from a place of emptiness and using psychedelics to train oneself to be okay with chaos and groundlessness. Music by The Go Set.
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