128. Dr. James Fetzer On Survival of Consciousness and Near-Death Experience (NDE) Science

Summary: The author of, Philosophy of Cognitive Science, discusses why NDE evidence doesn’t measure up. Join Skeptiko host Alex Tsakiris for an interview with philosophy of science and human consciousness scholar, Dr. James Fetzer. During the interview Mr. Tsakiris and Dr. Fetzer discuss evidence for the survival of consciousness, and whether this evidence undermines our current model of mind=brain consciousness: Alex Tsakiris: So let’s take a big step back and say that when someone has a flat EEG they are not supposed to have any conscious experience, let alone the kind of conscious experience near-death experiencers are reporting. What you say might be definitionally true and all that, but we just have to deal with the fact that people are having a conscious experience when they shouldn’t be having it. And that’s highly suggestive that consciousness doesn’t operate the way that we thought. It isn’t a product of the brain but is somehow separate from the brain and continues after the brain is severely compromised, if you want me to say it isn’t dead. Dr. James Fetzer: Well, as soon as you begin talking about an ordinary concept of consciousness you have to acknowledge that consciousness involves responses to stimuli in the environment that we access through our different senses, taste, touch, smell, sight, and hearing. Therefore, if we’re going to talk seriously about a form of consciousness that persists after death, we’re going to have to account for how it’s possible to have sensory experiences for an entity that is no longer embodied. In other words, if you no longer have your senses, if you no longer have a capacity for taste, touch, sight, smell, or hearing, how can you possibly have any conscious experiences after you’re dead? What we do know, Alex, is that when the brain is deprived of oxygen, the kinds of experiences that are typified by the reports of those who have these near-death experiences occur. Alex Tsakiris: That’s absolutely not true, Jim. You just haven’t delved into the. Dr. James Fetzer: Alex, that’s all just fine and dandy and I did not previously express any concerns about it. You have been pressing me on this point and I’m explaining to you that based on classic criteria from the philosophy of science, your proposition of the survival of consciousness after death is a paradigm case of an empirically untestable claim. Dr. James Fetzer’s website Play it: Download MP3 (28:00 min.) Read it: Welcome to Skeptiko where we explore controversial science with leading researchers, thinkers, and their critics. I’m your host, Alex Tsakiris. On this episode of Skeptiko we return to a topic that I’ve addressed many times before, and that is near-death experience science and how it squares with the mainstream science model of consciousness. That is, of course, that consciousness is solely and completely a product of the brain. Now I’ve wrestled this issue to the ground before, but it was really fun to dialogue with someone who I greatly respect and admire for his ability to courageously follow the data wherever it goes on a whole variety of topics that are certainly very, very controversial. Here’s my interview with Dr. Jim Fetzer: Alex Tsakiris: Today we welcome back to Skeptiko Dr. James Fetzer, who is best known as one of the world’s leading authorities on the JFK assassination and the events of 9/11. But he’s also a scholar and author in the area of human consciousness. He’s written several books and many scholarly papers on the topic. So, Jim, thanks so much for joining me again today on Skeptiko. Dr. James Fetzer: Oh, Alex, it’s a real pleasure. I like the way you operate at a very high level of professionalism and I think your site is beautifully managed. Alex Tsakiris: Thanks a lot for saying that. It’s quite an honor coming from you. One of the reasons I’m s[...]