Wag Out Loud show

Wag Out Loud

Summary: The Wag Out Loud pawdcast started as a passion project that would help all of us to be the BEST advocates for our dogs’ health and wellness. After many amazing guests, intriguing topics and incredible feedback, the WOL pawdcast is hitting a nerve with dog lovers all over the world. Why is it that over 50% of our dogs are getting cancer? I believe it is because of the extreme toxic load that are dogs are taking on from not only their poor diets, but from their environment as well. We can do so much better for our dogs, but first we need to be educated on how to make the right choices for our dogs, to help them lead longer and healthier lives. Our short and succinct episodes (about 30 mins each) feature experts in the fields of canine health, nutrition, and wellness as well as recommendations about products and services that I've used, know, like and trust and have found to enhance the lives of dogs. My name is Krista and I am the host of the WOL pawdcast. After receiving my certification in canine nutrition and noticing that most dogs are getting sicker and living shorter lives, I have become obsessed with bringing experts and dog enthusiasts together in committed community. Together we can learn about the most updated science, treatments, protocols and products that will benefit both the mental and physical health of our pups. I continue to learn something every single day. This show mostly features topics and opinions from those in the holistic and integrative veterinary health industry. We address things like dental health, over vaccination, nutrition, benefits of feeding raw, gut health and the immune system, common canine diseases, aging issues, behavioral issues, cognition and so much more. You love your dog, right? And you want to provide them with the best life possible. Let’s learn together. No matter where you live, your financial status, how many dogs you have, if they are a pure breed or mixed, we have something for every dog parent on the planet. Dogs are such amazing creatures and are a part of our families. As research continues, we are learning more and more about how they enhance our lives. It’s time to give back all of the unconditional love that our dogs show us. They are here to teach us so many things…we just need to know how to listen. Nothing and I mean nothing, in the dog industry is regulated. That includes food, treats, supplements or the manufacturing of dog products. It really is like the wild, wild west and we have to do our own research on products, ingredients and materials. We can’t be fooled by false marketing claims. This is the only podcast that focuses on practical, actionable tips and strategies to help your dog to thrive. Tune in for the latest research, science-based information, natural alternatives and inspiration for ensuring you are making well-informed decisions, when it comes to your dog’s health and happiness. Just think of Wag Out Loud as the ultimate resource for the dog lover who is on a quest to provide the best care for his/her canine companion(s). I am the guide that helps you to navigate the landscape of conflicting and confusing information in the ever-growing pet health space. Listen in to all of the Wag Out Loud pawdcast episodes and be sure to tell your dog-loving friends about the Show. Your dog will thank you!

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 Trick Training: The Benefits for Physical & Mental Health for You AND Your Dog | File Type: audio/mpeg | Duration: 00:34:51

I hope everyone's year is off to a fantastic start.!This is Krista with episode #144 on the Wag Out Loud pawdcast. Most of us know that chocolate is poisonous to dogs. But did you know that the type and color of chocolate that they eat is super important? Well, the rule of thumb is the darker and the more bitter, the more dangerous it is to our dogs. So take baking chocolate or gourmet dark chocolate. They contain significantly more theobromine, which is the chemical that is similar to caffeine, but it can't be metabolized by our dogs, so it puts them at risk for actual poisoning. So it's more dangerous than milk chocolate, and white chocolate hardly has any. So to put it in perspective, a healthy 50 pound dog could be poisoned by just one ounce of dark chocolate, but it would have to ingest nine ounces of milk chocolate to experience the same serious problems. If your dog displays any signs of poisoning, which could be vomiting, diarrhea, increased thirst, racing, heart rate, excessive urination, please take them to the vet immediately. Welcome to the Wag Out Loud pawdcast, where we are obsessed with bringing you helpful tips on canine health care, nutrition, and overall wellbeing. If you'd like to support the show, check out the amazing online events, products and resources that I personally recommend on the Wag Out Loud website. I'm your host, Krista and I'm super excited to be bringing you yet another tail wagging episode.  Chrissy Joy is a 2021 International Trick Dog Champion, former National Stunt Dog Champion, has appeared on America's Got Talent, is a passionate canine studio trainer - avid hiker and vanlife! She is Dog Mom and Momager to The Joy Crew - canine celebrities as seen on Paramount Pictures, Chewy, LIONSGATE, and so much more. Well, hello dog lovers! Chrissy joy is our guest today and she has a few tricks up her sleeve. Chrissy, thanks so much for being with us today. I would love it if you could introduce yourself and tell us how you got into the world of trick training. Hi, everyone. So yes, thank you for that really warm welcome. My name is Chrissy Joy and I am a professional dog trainer. But my specialty is trick training. And that's kind of something that I'm really passionate about that has kind of immersed into my career as well. I currently own the International Trick Dog Champion. We won that award earlier this year. And we do all sorts of things for live shows, film, television, demos, workshops, things like that as well. So you could call me Dog Crazy. I think that's a pretty accurate title for me. And I would say that, you know, when I began training over at a facility called BFF Pet Services really, really wonderful facility. I wasn't sure what direction I wanted to go. And I just wanted to have a well behaved dog kind of like everybody's initial start with their dog and I have a rescue named Beasley. I just wanted to have, you know, just like a good obedience and don't jump on the counter and don’t jump on people, you know, that kind of thing. But I quickly learned about the world of dog training as far as trick training goes. And so it really opened doors to kind of, you know, work with your dog in a new way. That is very, very possible and very fun and easy, but also a great mental challenge for you and your dog. And that's something that I really enjoyed. It kind of opened up the doors for us to kind of have a bond that was a little bit different from you know, just your general leash, obedience based training. And so we really dove into trick training and now we do all sorts of crazy things with tricks. That is so cool. And what kind of dog is Beasley? Beasley is one of three of the Joy Crew and Beasley is a 60 pound mutt. We don't know exactly, but we think he’s a Collie, maybe some Shepherd, wicked smart, probably the smartest of the three and the work he does is is unparalleled. That's so cool. Well, Chrissy, you're here to talk to us about the benefits for physical and mental health for you and your dog when it comes to trick training. So if it's okay with you, I was going to start with just naming a benefit. And then I would love for you to unpack each one for us, if you could do that. Sure. So I would say one, one of the first benefits I think of for trick training for dogs that people aren't intending on doing live shows but I just want to try something new. Is it is very big for confidence building. So confidence building is is a big thing that we see in many dogs, especially dogs coming out of COVID. Puppies that are, you know, been adopted or through breeders, you know, and they didn’t get proper exposure. trick training allows a lot of confidence building, because what you're doing is you're asking your dog to work with different props, maybe interact with different props, things that make noises, you know, and you're kind of, you're giving the dog a chance to build confidence in an arena that's very positive based, so lots of treat rewards or toy rewards. And so that and also it includes you physically touching your dog, you know in different ways that that you don't typically do when you're walking in a heel in class, you're asking for their paw, you're asking him to spin in a circle, you're doing a rollover, you know, all these types of things, you're getting the dog to have more body awareness, and through physical tasks, which also makes them more confident when working with you. Because I know, I think we all know a dog where you try to touch their foot, they're like, nope, no, don’t touch me, right? No, I don't want to touch my foot. That means you’re gonna trim my nails, right. And so we desensitize a lot of that through different elements of trick training. That's a great point. Because, you know, of course, you can teach your dog tricks at home. But maybe you have a dog that's a little timid. And if you enroll them in a tricks class, I think that would be a confidence booster as well, because they're in a room with other dogs doing tricks, and might just gain confidence just by watching the other dogs, right? That's right. And honestly, being in a room full of other dogs is a great way to teach your dog to be comfortable around other dogs while still learning to focus on you. And still learning to focus on the task at hand. And sometimes obedience can be a little bit, it can just be a little bit overwhelming for a dog, whereas we start very ground level with tricks. We’ll say, you know, like, simple touching the nose to your hand and giving a treat, you really break it down so that the smallest thing that your dog can do for you will be rewarded. And it really helps them kind of learn how to thrive in a, in a stressful environment by doing something very simple and being rewarded for it. Whereas, you know, with obedience it’s sit, stay, heel, you know, these are big things we're asking for our dogs to be able to do in a busy environment. Whereas a nose touch, or a spin can be a lot more easy going on the dog to kind of interact with you and be close with you without the pressures of having to be in a perfect heel and things like that. Okay, well, what about trick training for developing patience? That's a great one. So impulse control is gigantic for trick training, you know, there's a lot of things that I do for that work as well, where we have a trick the dog needs to perform, but there may be elements to it, as far as it can't happen until something else happens, which we call a change behavior. So, for example, you know, in order for the dog to get the reward, they learn not only do they have to open the fridge, they have to get the drink out of the fridge. And your dog has to learn impulse control to do one before the other. But also there's there's elements of duration, you know, we ask our dogs to hold an item, you know, for an extended period of time. And that can be a great trick to hold the basket or hold, you know, a sign or whatever it may be. And so they have to learn duration, which is also an element of patience. And something that we always we I say as BFF because I do train through BFF. But something that I always instill upon any dog I train is that quiet feet, quiet mind. So you know, I want the dog to be able to, to not be tap dancing around and I want them to be quiet feet so we can have a quiet mind. So we can do this type of work that's going to require them to be patient, and to be focused. Yep. And you don't want them to get frustrated. So when you're talking about patience, I'm sure that there is a certain time limit, like you don't want to do this for hours and repetitively. And they're going to get frustrated, they're going to get bored, they're going to get tired. So what are your suggestions? As far as how long when you're teaching a brand new trick? That's a great question I get a lot of people always ask me, or say you must do an hours a day. And I'm like, Well, the truth of the matter is I really don't. I do like two 15 minute sessions, and then I do a lot of cardio for their exercise. That's their physical simulation and their mental is those 15 minute sessions. You know, I compare it to as if you had a big test, you know, coming up in a month. There's the people who are going to cram the night before and don't get me wrong. You may do okay on the day of the test. But if I asked you a year later, you probably can't remember any of that information. But if you did it in little bits and pieces, and you just absorb the information, a chapter at a time. Then when it came test time, you're going to retain a lot more when you need to do this, do this test or this exam and pass it and do a good job while not being stressed out, exhausted, you know, and now you're less likely to want to study for the next test because it was so stressful to cram the night before. You know what I mean? So I kind of relate it to that because I do very small session and there's tricks that we pick up right away. And there's, there's tricks that take me over a year to get correct. And so what I always say is very small sessions, break up that trick into many pieces, right, so don't try to just get the whole trick on the first day, unless it's something they can do easily like spin. But if you're doing something more complicated, break it down into many pieces, you may not have a good session, the first time just learning the first ways to do a trick. I always suggest, if you're not getting it at all, finish the session with something your dog does know how to do. So at least they end on a really positive note. And then always leave the session leaving the dog wanting more, don't burn them out. And then say, Okay, we're done. You know, always leave while the dog is still feeling good and has energy and is eager to work. I always go all done. Because then when I go to work next time, the dog. is like, I really want to do that again, right versus Oh, I don't want to do three hours of this exhausting thing that is too stressful for me. And I never got anything out of it where I felt confident. So, short and sweet. Have the right motivators, as far as treats, varieties of treats. I always feed a little less if I intend on training a lot one day because I don't want their stomach to be overwhelmed. You got to think about how much you put in during a training session as well. And so, yeah, that that's kind of my mantra is keep it short and sweet. Do it over a long period of time, break it down into small pieces and always end on a high note. Okay, well, you briefly mentioned earlier that trick training involves getting your dog not only physical exercise, but of course, they're doing a lot of mental exercise from doing tricks as well. What are your thoughts about that? Because we're giving treats. So people might think, how much is too much? What kind of treats should I give? Because we don't want to overload them with calories? Of course, I guess I'm, I'm asking a lot of questions in this. But why don't you just tell us about how trick training impacts physical and mental exercise? Of course, and I always say if you can I'm, I will proudly say I am very stingy. And people like oh, that sounds terrible. But actually, I'll take any treats that I'm going to give and I break it into a lot of pieces, right? Because it's not so much like, wow, I got a whole cookie for doing that. It's just about I got a reward, I got something telling me I did it right. So I break something down into lots of little pieces. Zukes even has low calorie treats, which are awesome. And then my higher value… because you always want to have a higher value. Because you don't want to train with the Cheerios, you want to train with the filet mignon. When you're in those more stressful environments. I use Rogue Pet Science, they have a great line of jerky that are like you could eat it practically. But besides the treat wise, what I like to do is focus on two different kinds of trick training. So I do the physical aspects where I use a lot of like fitness equipment, and teaching the dog to back their legs up on fitness equipment teaching them about proprioception, which is just a knowledge of their body. And so we do lots of stretches we do backing their feet up almost like doing a handstand, which my dogs do walking handstands, at least two of them do. But you want to make sure they're physically fit to do something like that. You don't just throw your dog into an action like that. Like you couldn't ask me today to go do a handstand, I would hurt myself, right? You have to you have to physically build them up to that. But by doing that you're actually teaching them tricks as well. You know, we do leg stretches, things like that. You can do bow or spin. Those are great stretches to offer. And so that helps them with that physical fitness aspect. And of course, if you want to count in frisbee or other things like agility running through a tunnel, if you want to call those things tricks, which in some element, they are considered tricks, that's a great outlet for your dog to have, you know their physical needs met. On the mental side, I love puzzle toys. That's the most independent play you could offer them as far as like putting a toy down that they have to work out the food for. I love doing breakfast in puzzle toys because it makes the dog think versus just eating out of a bowl. But also then there's there's there's higher elements like to the extreme sense Beasley plays memory. So if you flip the cards face down, he can match them as far as which ones which once he sees them, but on a smaller sense you can do what's called the Cup game or the Shell game where you put you know, one toy under one cup and there's three cups and you move the cups around and the dog has to remember or sniff out where that toy is or whatever. It's just a fun mental game for your dog. So there's these two elements that your dogs need. Some people say, Well, I run my dog five miles a day, but they’re still running around the house. Well, probably because his physical needs are being met. But mentally, he's not exhausted, he needs something else to do, he needs a job, right? And that's where you find if you don't satisfy them, even on the most simple level of a puzzle toy, they will create their own job which could create their own problem. True. Well, this is a good place for us to take a pause while we do a quick sponsor break, so we will be right back. SPONSOR AD Thanks to our friends at AnimalBiome for sponsoring today's episode.  They are brilliant at applying science to improve your dog’s health.  Did you know that 60-70% of your dog’s immune cells are located in the gut microbiome?  And when their microbiome is out of balance, it can lead to inflammation associated with GI and skin issues.  My dog Winston was tested and the results were shocking!  He had way too many harmful bacteria and too few strains of the beneficial bacteria.  No wonder his immune system was always compromised!  Thanks to the AnimalBiome team for getting him back on track so that he can live a much healthier life!  Isn’t it time to test your dog’s gut health? Learn more by going to https://animalbiome.com/home and be sure to use the discount code WOL-20 for 20% off! And we are back with our special guest Chrissy joy, who is the 2021 International Trick Dog Champion. And we're chatting about trick training and all of the benefits that trick training does for our dogs. So Chrissy, we're going to continue here, why don't we talk about how tricks help with your dog's excess energy because we just talked about the physical and the mental benefits. But we all know that a bored dog is going to find other ways to let out their energy like chewing or barking or what have you. So how does trick training rein them in? Well, one thing that it does is that your dog has natural physical and mental needs to be satisfied by so you know, some dogs are from working minds. And while people love the look of Border Collies and how loyal and sweet they are, you know, they are working dogs that were bred to run miles day. So you need to be able to, you know, satisfy those needs in order for your dog to be in a situation where they can rest and relax and kind of be, you know, a wonderful dog at home. So understanding the type of dog you do have even before you choose to get one. And understanding what you're getting into is what's really going to help you kind of know, to what extent you're going to need to do this type of work. For example, my one dog Beasley is a mutt 60 pounds, I would say he's average activity level, he would sleep all day, if I let him. He loves to play, but he doesn't need much walk, one or two miles a day, he'd be fine. I have a border collie in the other room right now that I can hear throwing his toy around incessantly, because he must stay busy all day long. Only around nine or 10 o'clock at night, will he finally conk out. So you know right after this, we're going to go and do a lot of physical activity to kind of satisfy those needs to help him burn off that energy. And so so what I like to say is that if you can create that balance and every dog is different, you’ll really have a dog that's not going to pick up bad habits are not going to be bored enough to do that type of behavior, or for dealing with things like anxiety or crate anxiety, you may even lessen that, if you have them tired out where they are satisfied in those ways. And you'll actually find that your dog's habits or maybe barking or you know, excitability will actually calm down because a lot of those nerves can be good or bad. But that does come up from this pent up I need a job or you know, I need to burn out some energy. And so I actually had a recent person, friend call me and say, you know, my dog just jumps on us, won’t stop barking, you know, barking around the house at everything, you know, just getting into trouble everywhere. And she said, you know, and I do feel bad. I have a really I have a full time job. And so, you know, he has to be created most of the day. And I said, the first thing you could do is hire a dog walker, get somebody to come in the middle of the day, and walk your dog and give them some exercise because it’s manifesting in all these other things that you're starting to see. Not because the dog is sad, but because he simply just doesn't have an outlet. Right. Well, just from what you said, I would have to imagine that doing trick training pretty much would improve their overall obedience and their manners. Is that true? It does it creates a better communication line between you and your dog. You know I can with just, you know a hand gesture without even touching my dog, I can get my dog to like, move to the left or to the right or backup or, you know, like you and you work together, we do a lot of doggy dancing, as well. So that's where the dog actually works with you, and does a lot of moves. You know, weaving through your legs, jumping off your back, you know, like, you know, a little more showy things. But I have such a better communication line with my dogs doing trick training is opened up the doors to build that bond, on a one on one level, I'm not so much just telling my dog what to do as far as what you may see, and like, you know, sit, stay, come heel, you know, be good stay in this box, right? Because you think of obedience, like a box, sometimes like stay in this box, I need you to stay here and do these things. Trick training is a lot more creative outlets, and, you know, asking your dog to interact with things in different ways, with their paw, with their nose, maybe they're rolling, rolling a blanket around, around themselves, you're asking them to interact in different ways. And I think through having that one on one time with them, you learn a lot about their personality, for example, I can't give something soft and squishy to one dog, because he'll just puncture it and it'll be a mess. Whereas my other dog is very, very delicate with prop.s The other one's really bold. So I have all these understandings about their personalities that I may not have picked up on had I not tried to do some different things with my dogs. I'm blown away by this is just so simple, it sounds like but so much fun. And in the end, it sounds like the best reward of all in trick training, is that it just strengthens the bond between you and your dog. So can all dogs do trick training? Yeah, so that's the beauty of it is all dogs can do trick training. You know, there are dogs that I know, that are, you know, a handful of pounds that are doing the same trick that your fancy Border Collies are doing. And I love my work, I have two of them myself, but you know, there's a there's an element of well, I guess my dog has to be smart, you know, the smart breed or whatever they say. And that's not necessarily true any dog can do it can do all sorts of tricks. In fact, some tricks are even, you know, people cross over to do service, dog tasks you know, it's the same element, but the dog has a much more structured lifestyle, because it's to be a service dog. But a lot of those things can pass over picking up items, you know, opening doors, closing doors, things like that. And so that's the beauty of it is I always like to tell people, it's not just any dog, it's any age. So dogs with disabilities are doing trick training, there really is no limitation, you just may have limitations in what types of props your dog can work with. And that's a whole other discussion of figuring out, you know, is this the right size prop? Is it too big for my dog, you know, a lot of times we work on set for TV and film, they want our dogs to work with something like a prop, we always say, Well, let me see it first. Because you know, maybe it has to be a certain size or texture, you know, so the dog was able to finagle the door open or hold that shoe, you know, it can't be a heavy military boot, it has to be more like a loafer. So it's about understanding what works well for your dog to set them up for success. But I do love to say, and I hope I inspire everyone, when I do say is just try it. You know, just give it a shot, teach your dog something new, you may never have to use it. But it's fun to have. And it's something different. And it also is a great way to distract your dog. If they're overly stimulated by something, you can quickly bring them into your world and do a couple of tricks with them to kind of help reset them and bring them back to focusing on you. Right. Well, you mentioned setting them up for success with trick training. How do you recommend starting with, I would have to assume you start with a certain trick. And then you build from that trick, you don't just throw a complicated trick at them. You want to build up to that, is that right? That's right. And you know, when I start my sessions, I actually funny enough, I take a bunch of treats, and I just start tossing them around the floor. Just encouraging my dog to be happy to go chase the treat and just being interested in doing work with me. I rarely ever, like bring them into a room and make them sit and get them right to work. You know, I let them like kind of choose to work with me by tossing treats and keeping it real low stress. And they generally are like, Oh, this is fun. Okay, what's next? You know, and then I'll then I'll start to go from there. And yes, I do say if you are doing complicated tricks, like I said a little bit earlier, is break it down into very, very edible pieces. If I'm going to get my dog to open up a fridge door, the first day, I may just have them be touching their nose to the let's say dish towel that they're eventually going to pull. So I just have them touch it. No big deal. touch touch. We're good. Some dogs will leap right into it like Darby is gonna run up to it and he's going to yank on it. Well, that's even better if my dog but I'm just gonna keep it Real simple, and I’ll probably finish with them doing some tricks they know really well, to just kind of put the bow on the gift there and really like seal the deal. As far as it being like that was a great session, right? And I keep it that simple. Now there are some days where I'm like, Okay, we have to push it today. And it's gonna be hard. But I only do a few repetitions. And I always end, if I've got, I try to go for two to three, I'm getting two to three. Okay, we've moved forward a little bit action, like, Okay, I'm seeing a progression here. If I can get it two to three times, I'll stop immediately, I won't go for 5,6,7,8 times, I want to get a high rate of success. And then I'm going to stop early, because they are going to retain that. And the next time we come back to it. Yeah, they may forget a little bit, but they'll go right back to that as soon as they figure out when the reward’s happening and when it's not. Yep. And do you always use verbal cues as well as physical cues? That's great. So I do I, so there's three elements there. I do free shaping, where free shaping is where you really have the dog start to interact with something without you giving them any, any feedback, as far as, Hey, do this now. So like, for example, if there's a box on the floor, and I want the dog to go in a box, every time he sticks his nose in the box, I'm going to reward just if he randomly sticks his nose in the box, I'm going to reward it and then he'll and then I'll stop rewarding when he does that. And I bet you he's going to offer me more to say, Okay, why isn't that working anymore? What else do I have to do. And eventually, they'll put their paw in the box, right? And then you know, we reward from there. So I like free shaping, because I don't like to always just lire my dog like, Hey, here's the treat, follow it and do this. I think the dog thinks a lot less when you do stuff like that, he's not really thinking. It's just kind of like going on cruise control. And I really want the dog to be thinking. So it's a little bit more of an advanced approach, but it's what I like to do. But as far as the other ways, physical and verbal 100% I use both. But I try to separate how I do it. For example, I'll say, spin, and then I'll motion with the hand. So like, I try to put them on two different train tracks, pulling into the same station. So by doing spin, and then using my hand, I'm not doing it at the same time, which means at some point, I can do either or, and the dog should be able to know what it means. But if I always layer it together, then the dog doesn't see it as anything different. Right? So if I'm on set, I can't yell spin when the actress is talking. But I could use my hand motion, and he's gonna understand, you know, it's either A or B, it has the same has the same solution. How do you suggest that we learn because I know there's books on dog tricks? I know there's classes, there's probably courses, what do you suggest the best way to learn how to do fun tricks? Oh, it there's so many great outlets, I would say what I call kind of like the couch to 5K and I say that with a loving heart. Because I think it's a great program is the Do More With Your Dog program. I think it's the most at home friendly, really nice, attractive books that come out. Like there's one called 101 Dog Tricks on Amazon. But do more with your dog. It's great for people who have like, I've never done this before. And online, there's like super cool groups you can join. And people are always trying to help each other. And it's just a really nice little community. So I love that. Also, if you want to take any of my online trick based stuff, you can check out BFF Pet Services, and there's some online courses there. If you live in the Maryland area, we'd love to see you. But you can there's some great ones that on there as far as doing some more of the trickier tricks, I guess you could say. And then I say you know, just honestly, it's all about if I were to be brutally honest, is you know, get in get into a training facility so you can understand what it's like to when to when should you reward your dog and how does that work and your basic obedience class will be so useful to you. But it's a lot of trial and error. You know, I have to be very honest, when I taught tricks myself. Like when I taught tricks, I just trial and errored the entire way through, I had a guideline of what tricks I wanted to do. And then I just said, Okay, we're just gonna, we're just gonna see how this works. We're gonna figure it out together. Now not everyone can do that. That's fine. Definitely hook up to a positive reinforcement training facility that can help you. And a lot of those places do have trick classes. And it might be helpful to have that one on one experience with a trainer. A lot of it is trial and error. And before you know it, you start to learn how your dog learns, and a lot of the stuff you can start to do on your own. Great, great advice. Wow, I'm so excited. I Well, Winston used to be a therapy dog. So we went into assisted living places. And the people just loved watching him do tricks. And it forced me to teach him a new one before we went back, because of course, that's the first question, What trick can he do now? So that is right, so much fun. But I have to say, when Winston knows we're gonna do tricks, he'll do all of them back to back saying, Oh, which one does she want? I'm gonna do them all. Kind of funny. And so they and it's funny, dogs will start to kind of create their own movement they think is what you want. And if it's something you like, you can capture it, and then it becomes its own trick. So we've got a few things like my dog will sneeze, and then I'll reward and now it's, it's now it's a trick that he sneezes on command. I know. And so there's, there's all, there's all sorts of… your dog can also like help you you might go, I never thought of doing it that way. But I love that he does it that way. Like that's a much cooler way than I would have trained. And that's how he likes to do it. That's his style. And you can reward that. And that's kind of the fun part of trick training too, is that like, there's no limit. There's tricks that people have never done, but it's just because, you know, no one's thought of it yet. And so you see a lot of them and there's a film out if anybody wants to watch it. It's called Agent Toby Barks with my dog Beasley, he's a spy dog. He's the lead in the movie, the principal actor, and he does every single trick himself. There was no stunt double. There was no fake paws, nothing like that. So if you want to see a lot of tricks in a very creative cinematic sense, that's a really cool film to look at all the different props we worked with, in order to get the film done. How cool. Well, I will definitely put all these links in the show notes of everything that you mentioned. So as we are about to sign off here, Chrissy where can everyone find out more information about you? Yes, please. I'm very available on Instagram and Facebook and even Tik Tok? Yes, I'm there as well. You can follow @thechrissyjoy and also @thejoycrew. So @thejoycrew are all the dogs @thechrissyjoy is more of the training. And, you know, my personal adventures and things like that as well. We love to go hiking and backpacking. If anybody's into that as well, there’s tons of content that we do van life and things that we do every year. But we'd love to have you guys follow us and reach out and I’'m always available. And yeah, I hope I hope you guys enjoyed what I had to share today. But I always leave everyone with the note that I please I hope that you can always be inspired to do something more with your dog. And also, you know, take them on your adventures because it's just it's memories that will last a lifetime. Social Media URLs or Tags          Instagram: @thechrissyjoy  @thejoycrew           Facebook: @thechrissyjoy @thejoycrew           LinkedIn: ChrissyJoy website URL www.chrissyjoy.com I totally agree. Well, Chrissy, thank you so much. This has been so much fun. And I can't wait. You know, please tag both Chrissy and I @thechrissyjoy and @wagoutloud with any fun tricks that you teach your dog. We would love to see videos. So there's just so many benefits. And Chrissy thanks for being here today and sharing all of them. Yes, of course. And hopefully we'll be talking again and we can talk about more fun things to come. Sounds good. Thanks again to the team at AnimalBiome for sponsoring this episode.  Learn more by going to animalbiome.com and be sure to use the discount code WOL-20 for 20% off.  Your dog will thank you! Thanks for listening. You'll find some helpful links in the show notes and if you enjoy the show, please be sure to follow and listen for free on your favorite podcast app. And please, please share your feedback. Visit WagOutLoud.com for great product recommendations with discounts, amazing online events and fantastic resources. That's also where to visit our Bark About It page where you can suggest topics, guests or products. Be advised that this show offers health and nutritional information and is designed for educational purposes only. You're encouraged to do your own research and should not rely on this information as a substitute for nor does it replace professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. If you have any concerns or questions about your dog's health, you should always consult a veterinarian or a nutrition expert. Have a tail wagging day and we'll catch you next time. Hey Winston was that another tail wagging episode?

 Food to Fight Disease! A Vet Pathologist's Perspective | File Type: audio/mpeg | Duration: 00:36:05

Happy New Year everyone! This is Krista with episode #143 on the Wag Out Loud pawdcast. Have you checked out all of the amazing partner products that I highly recommend? These are products that I have tried and feel secure recommending to you and will help your dog to thrive. So just go to https://www.wagoutloud.com/ and check out the Partner Products section. And notice that I've negotiated discounts for most of these items, so why not see what can make a difference in your dog's life? What is hypothyroidism in dogs? Well, it's caused by fluctuations in hormones caused by inflammation or shrinkage of the thyroid gland. And actually more than 95% of hypothyroid canine cases are caused by unknown thyroid gland atrophy or immune destruction of the thyroid. Some of the classic signs of hypothyroidism are weight gain without an increase in appetite, loss of energy, lack of desire to exercise, your dog will get cold easily, their hair is dry or dull, they might be shedding excessively, increased dark pigmentation in their skin, they are more susceptible to skin and ear infections. They have a failure to regrow hair after they've been clipped or shaved, have high blood cholesterol or a slow heart rate. And basically this is a condition where metabolism slows down because the thyroid gland is under active. But it's really easy to have your vet do blood tests to check your dog's thyroid function. Welcome to the Wag Out Loud pawdcast, where we are obsessed with bringing you helpful tips on canine health care, nutrition, and overall wellbeing. If you'd like to support the show, check out the amazing online events, products and resources that I personally recommend on the Wag Out Loud website. I'm your host, Krista and I'm super excited to be bringing you yet another tail wagging episode. Growing up with a garden full of fresh food, getting an education in vet med and vet pathology, Dr. Suzee Camilleri combined her passions for understanding how food influences diseases in dogs. She helps dog parents navigate the very busy and confusing world of dog food and how to choose ones that help decrease chances of disease and live a longer life! Hello dog lovers! Thanks for tuning in to yet another awesome Wag Out Loud pawdcast episode. And today I am thrilled to have Dr. Suzee Camilleri on the Show and she's going to share Food to Fight Disease: a Vet Pathologist’s Perspective. So Dr. Suzee, thank you, first of all for being here today. Would you please introduce yourself and tell us why you've dedicated your life to the study of how food can be the best medicine, especially for our dogs? Thank you so much. I'm so excited to be here with you. Essentially, I went to vet school and I really liked pathology. I found it really interesting how diseases worked. So I went on to do a residency. And then I worked in academia with different animal models of human disease and worked with doctors and scientists to figure out how different diseases work. And essentially, through a lot of the animal research, there was very interesting findings in studies that were using different foods to test different parameters in animals. And I always found those studies really, really interesting. And just on a personal note, growing up, I grew up with a European family where he had a huge garden, we ate fresh vegetables, fresh food all the time. And as my parents got older, I could see a difference in how they were aging in terms of sticking with fresh foods. It really helped and I decided that food is our best medicine for protecting us from aging. And that's for us as well as our animals. So I shifted my career out of the lab into dog nutrition consulting, and helping pet parents navigate this crazy world of a billion dog foods that are out there. Well, thank you for doing what you do. Because I mean, you and I both know that the dog food landscape is literally the Wild West. And totally agree with not really having any regulations in place there. You know, people think oh, there must be an agency or organization that regulates dog food. Well, there isn't. So how do you suggest that we navigate this crazy world of pet food to find the best food for our dogs? That's the million dollar question. It's interesting, because there's different ways to go about it, depending on what your background and motivation, and how much time you have. So I find people who have had dogs that have had diseases where certain medicines and certain prescription diets have not worked, that they tend to really, really research, what foods are good and try to find out everything they can. But not everyone has the time to do that. Or the inclination, maybe their dog is on, you know, a generic kibble that they thought was okay. And the dog seems fine. But I think the most important thing is, educate yourself on it and question things, I think that's the biggest thing, because I think this whole, all of pet food is undergoing a huge disruption. Because humans, people have questioned where their own food is coming from. We've done a lot of digging, we found a lot of things we didn't like. And now we're doing the same with our pets’ food. And I think, talking to people, finding reputable people, reputable resources, you know, you can start with your vet. There's a lot of vets out there who are trying to make this better, and recommend better Whole Foods. And but remember, it's a system, right, these pet food companies have been around for so long. And I grew up thinking that feeding our dog kibble was just it's just what you did, because you know, 30 years ago, that's what everybody did. So I think having an open mind, really questioning, like when you go and buy some food, look at the ingredients. Do you understand it? Do you know where it's coming from? Do you know what it is? And then make decisions as best you can from that? Right. You know, it blows my mind. You talked about kibble. And I didn't know this before I got into this space, that kibble or dry dog food was originally designed as a short term option for dogs in the war overseas. You know, it was easy to store, it didn't need refrigeration. So it just blows my mind that it's even still around. Because before kibble even came on to the scene, you know, we were feeding fresh whole food table scraps, and then they had this marketing campaign. Oh, no, that's bad for your dog. No, don't give your dog people food. Right. Here we are, with, as you said, these billion dollar companies that I won't name names, but one is a candy manufacturer. Like, okay, do they have any business in the dog food space? Right, you know? So it blows my mind that this is where we are. But I think I agree with you that people are asking questions, and the word is getting out. And veterinarians are slowly thinking differently, because we know they don't have nutrition in vet school still, which, why? When I was in vet school, too, it was all we learned a little bit about toxic things like you know, obviously, if a dog, too much of anything is bad, mainly about like, vitamin deficiencies and vitamin overdoses, right? Because those things can happen in animals. But I think like when you think about the big picture in terms of food, and food science and nutrition, when I was in vet school, and I think the same is for human doctors, nutrition was always considered the soft science, right? There was not the science to back up that, let's say eating greens would help decrease cancer or something like that. Because and that's when about midway through my career, I'm like, why is that? Why did nutrition not grow like these other sciences, when it's stuff we put in our bodies every day, three or four times a day, five times a day, six times a day. And we really don't know how it works in our bodies. We assumed we did and we know what happens if there's too much or too little, but didn't really look at it. Specifically in terms of what you know, when you break down kale and it breaks down in the digestive tract. What happens to everything and you know, it was never really tested out. And so what I found out was that nutrition really didn't get off the ground like other sciences like chemistry or toxicology because you couldn't get people, for example, for a period of six months to eat the same thing. And you know, drink the same thing. Whereas in lab animals, you can control their environment, their food, the lighting. So it just, you know, was not practical, and you couldn't do it. And I thought, okay, fine, but then we do have animals so we can try it in animals. And, you know, we live in a society where I think using animals for research is a privilege. So let's make the most of the information we get. So why not? You know, when you're testing a drug or something, why can't you have a subset that's eating really well, and taking the drug and see what happens? Right. So then I looked further into it, and thought okay, how do you get funding for this? And that was the problem. Yeah. Where do you get money from the government, because, you know, a lot of basic, unbiased research is done at research centers in academia, where, you know, we don't have companies funding the studies to keep it, ”unbiased”, but there wasn't anywhere to go, I couldn't go somewhere and say, Okay, I want to study how greens in dogs’ diets influence their health over four or five years. They're like, okay, that's nice. Well go fund it yourself. Right? No one's gonna fund that. So I started researching, you know, like, Raw was coming out, all these other diets were coming out, and I'm trying to find research on it, and no one's going to fund that. So that has been a big problem with new foods coming out for pets. A lot of those studies aren't even supported for humans or funded for humans, let alone for dogs, right. Like, you know, the whole Mediterranean diet, how they found out, it was good that was done like, over a period of 20-30 years studying different populations in the Mediterranean and taking their blood and getting cooperation from different cardiologists like, these are huge, huge efforts. But then, again, when you think about pets, there's less pets, so it should be easier to figure this out. And I think it's changing. I think there's, there's more research coming out on looking at, you know, fresh whole foods, looking at the different types of foods, what is it doing to their blood, their urine, their plasma, and now we're at an advantage too where pets are living longer. And people are paying more to keep their aging pets. So it's a really good opportunity that we have in science to collect samples from these animals and analyze them and find out, you know, you change your dog's diet in their senior years, maybe they live four or five years longer, you know, depending on, you know what you're doing. So, the more I dug into it, the more I found it, okay, it's so complicated. I was naive, right? I was younger, newer in my profession, and just thinking, oh, yeah, let's do this. Well, it's not that easy. It boils down to money. And I think one thing you said that really resonated with me is the marketing. Right? When that dry dog food for the war, they're like, oh, wow, this works. Somebody just said, Well, it's cheaper. Right has a longer shelf life. Why don't we just market it? And they did. And look how long it lasted. Oh, yeah. It's got a big juicy steak on the front of the bag. So it must be good for my dog. Well, we could talk for days, of course on. Yeah, marketing ploys out there. But to your point, I agree. In both human medicine as well, as you know, we're talking dogs. So canine veterinary medicine, things are coming out. You know, just a few years ago, I never knew about the gut microbiome, and how that played such a huge role in our immune system. So that translates into dogs. Leaky Gut Syndrome. That could be the core reason for so many ailments in our dogs. Okay, then. To me, it's just easy to go back to well, why is this happening? Oh, well kibble. Most kibble is over 40% carbohydrates, and many people including me, before I got into this, I never knew that dogs have no nutritional requirement for carbohydrates. Yet we are feeding them an equivalent of Captain Crunch cereal every day, twice a day for the rest of their life. Is that nutritionally sound? No, no And that's why we have the diseases, including the cancer rates are going up. So I'm going to get off my soapbox. And why don't we start with in your opinion, because I know there's two different camps, are dogs omnivores, or carnivores? You know, that I, I'm confused still, because I try to keep up to date on the literature. I tried to sort out what's, you know, good science, what's not good science. I'm tending towards they’re… and I'm not trying to sit on the fence. They're not as carnivorous as cats are. That's one thing that's become evident. And part of the reason from what I understand is that when they were domesticated dogs just lived closer to humans than cats did. And interestingly, I think what’s coming out. And I say, think because I'm still reading some papers on different enzyme levels in that that dogs have throughout their digestive tract is that they were fed some carbs. And I think over time, people saw that they were okay with it, right? Like, if you gave a dog a piece of bread, nothing happened. So out of necessity and costs, probably they just threw grains in to the food and thought nothing major is happening to them. So over the years, most of society thought, yeah, it's okay. And I think what happened is that probably their digestive system, very mildly adapted to that, so that they were because remember, dogs, we're talking 1000s of years, right? That dogs have been around. So within that time, it is possible for their metabolism, or digestive enzymes to adapt. And so I think there was an adaptation, and nothing major happened. But then more and more as society progressed to where we are, what's cheaper to put into the foods, right? Much cheaper than the proteins, so they did adapt. Now, does it give them optimal health? I don't think so. Okay, I'm going to stop you there because that's a perfect place to take a pause. We are gonna take a quick commercial break and we will be right back. We are so grateful to Dr. Harvey’s for sponsoring this episode. I am a huge fan of this company because they make high quality, human grade, natural products for our pets.  Made in the USA, Their lineup includes complete meal recipes, base mixes, freeze dried treats, chemical-free grooming products, and beneficial supplements to keep your dog stay healthy and happy.  I personally feed my dog Winston. Dr. Harvey’s Raw Vibrance base mix and just add water, my own raw meat and oil.  It’s that easy and it delivers complete nutrition.  They also have complete meals and recipes that promote health and longevity.  And the freeze-dried treats are a staple in our house and come in chicken hearts, rabbit or salmon bites.  There are so many reasons why I love Dr. Harvey’s and their products.  All I can say is try them for yourself.   Just go to https://www.drharveys.com/ and use the code WOL10 for 10% off of your order.  Okay, we are back in this great discussion with Dr. Suzee Camilleri. And you had just talked about carnivore or omnivore and I like where you're coming from. It's hard to I think they lean towards carnivore. But they can easily digest carbohydrates, plant matter. And I think we should be feeding a little bit of veggie and fruit for the phytonutrients and antioxidants, you know a little bit. So, again, we could talk just about that forever. So Dr. Suzee, in your mind, let's get right to it. What is the best diet for most healthy adult dogs? From what I see, they need a good chunk of protein that's just plain and simple. Right? They are not wolves but they evolved from wolves. So they have a very similar carnivorous digestive tract. They were fed carbs throughout history. And I think people did that out of convenience and cost and perhaps over time their system adjusted a little bit to some carbs. And people saw that nothing bad happened to them. Right. And this was where probably the marketing came in. And people just, I'm saying people, let's say companies are making dog foods, added these things because they, you know, meet the requirements for certain vitamins and minerals that were in these carbohydrates, and they could, you know, get the whole standards up to par using those cheaper ingredients. But were they necessarily really better for the dog? And that's where there's no straight answer yet. But I think it's becoming clear that feeding them good quality proteins, and Yep, definitely adding some vegetables, fruits, for the antioxidants, for fiber. Yeah, sorry, I totally forgot about the fats. Yeah, good quality fats. Give them optimal health. And I think now where studies are coming out, and again, I mean, we've talked about this before, it's hard to dissect out a good study from a bad study. And me being in science for over 15 years looking at quality journals and papers, you have to know what you're reading, if you don't understand it, take it to somebody who might understand it better, because it's very difficult to read some of these papers and figure out what the true conclusion is. And that's why it's so confusing for pet parents, because they read so many different things. It does get confusing, but to answer your question, bottom line, good, whole, non processed, quality proteins, you know, whether it's chicken, beef, and then adding in, it's basically like, a good meat, dinner with some salad on the side, so to speak, and some fruit and some oil on top right. Like, that's really how they thrive. That's how they thrive. And I think the nutrients they're getting from those fresh quality non processed foods is what gives them longevity too. Yeah. So we're talking about using food as medicine. What diseases in your mind would help with food therapy? Or what could you possibly prevent by feeding a species appropriate fresh food diet? Right? I think the biggest one that comes to mind is obesity. Pet obesity is the number one cause of a lot of morbidity and mortality in dogs and cats. And definitely, it's a very similar theme. It's so interesting, isn't it that even in humans, the more processed foods you eat the things that give you the fast glucose rush, lead to obesity. And it's the same thing with animals, even though they're not exactly like us. There's similarities in how they digest and process food, that giving them all of that. It's not just even extra calories, it's extra bad calories that lead to these metabolic diseases. So when I say obesity, underlying that comes with it. diabetes, arthritis and heart issues, right? Because obesity itself is like, how would you describe it? It's like a cup full of disease, right? You have obesity, and then in it, there's a bunch of other diseases that it causes. So I think, you know, if you, you look at that there's that's four diseases, then I listed right obesity, heart disease, osteoarthritis, diabetes, that can be manipulated, by giving your dog fresh quality food. And that's where, you know, some people say, Oh, food’s not medicine, dogs can't live forever. No, they can't. Nobody can live forever, unfortunately. But you want to give them the best life and slow down the disease. Basically, by giving fresh food, you’re eliminating or slowing down four major diseases that vets deal with every day, obesity, osteoarthritis, heart disease and diabetes. And there are studies to show that feeding fresh food can decrease these and it's not like I said, it's not just even the calories if you overfeed your dog fresh food here and there. It's okay. They're not going to die. You know, just take them for a longer walk or throw the ball a bit longer. And I honestly think that's where you know the food is medicine mantra has come down is that we can slow down aging. We can slow down obesity. We can slow down diabetes by these foods because this is how their body was meant to be. And you're optimizing their enzymes, their metabolism with natural micro, macronutrients that their bodies already know how to do. And they work optimally with those ingredients. Right? Okay. So the next step would be to get off of dry processed food. And factory farming is the norm. So we have that, which the animals that are being farmed to be put into pet food, they're not healthy. So we've got that part. And then when we talk about vegetables and fruits, here in the States, we use glyphosate on any crop except for organic. So in your mind, is it better to feed factory farmed meats, with veggies that have been sprayed with this awful pesticide that has been proven to cause disease? Or I guess it's safe to say, in a perfect world, if your finances allow it? We should be feeding pasture raised, pasture finished meats, and organic fruits and vegetables? Is that what you think as well? In my ideal world, we would all be eating that. Absolutely. I think it's just a no brainer. I think there's there's research out there to back it up, especially, you know, with all of these chemicals that they're finding in pets’ urine and human urine, that all of these things are just we can't go on using these things. But again, you brought up the point about budget. Yeah, it is not in everybody's budget to do this. So what do you do? Right, you know, we’re all doing our best, and some fresh veggies. If they're not organic, they're still much better than giving them a kibble from highly processed food that has not an ounce of freshness in it. Those vitamins and minerals, they're going to get those vitamins and minerals, from the fresh food that you figure out is the best food for your dog. And I honestly think it's still better. The other thing is, you know, different fruits and vegetables have different amounts of pesticides that are absorbed. So I'm just using kale again, just as an example, because it's just coming to mind. But don't always give your dog kale, you know, give them a variety of vegetables. And, and I do look at that. So it's like the Dirty Dozen and the Clean 15, I can't remember what it's called. They're the lists that they put out for produce that has the most and the least amount of pesticides on them. And given the ones that are, you're able to feed dogs, give them to them, the benefits still outweigh all the other negatives that highly processed foods will do to them in the long term. And mostly, I think where the evidence points to is, again, longevity in these animals, they’ll live, you know, they're not necessarily going to be 100% free of cancer, they might get some osteoarthritis, because these are normal age related things that happen, but you can slow it down. So if you have somebody that has a multi dog household that doesn't have the budget, what would you recommend? Should they because we have to be careful if we say, Oh, well, I'm just going to create a diet for my dog, and 99.9% of the time, you're going to be missing out on essential nutrients. And that's why at least with kibble, you can say it's complete and balanced with those added synthetic vitamins and minerals. So would you use something like that as a base, and then add maybe some cooked or fresh meat and some veggies to the bowl? Or look for another base? You know, there's so many bases now of veggie mixes. I like Dr. Harvey's .I love Dr. Harvey's and just adding meat and oil. It's a complete meal. Right? What do you suggest? Because you're right studies have shown just three times a week adding leafy greens to a kibble diet. The chances of getting cancer for that dog are in the 90 percentile, less chance of getting cancer just by putting leafy greens into the kibble bowl three times a week. I totally agree. I think bare minimum, somebody with, you know, a very basic budget who just cannot make things stretch. The one because I've had clients who've asked this. So you can, you can look online, there's lists of vegetables that are good for dogs and ones that are not. And one thing you can do is, let's say all you can get is kibble. That's all you can afford. Hopefully you're buying frozen vegetables for you and your family. You can give your dogs frozen vegetables as snacks, or put them on top of the kibble. As an example, I don't know why my dogs like this, but I started I think when they were young, I buy frozen brussels sprouts because I really love brussels sprouts, and I like to have them when they're off season. And I give them like three or four little frozen brussels sprouts and they go off, they think it's like a bone and it's crunchy. You know, you can give frozen carrots or if you have fresh stuff, you can just cut it up and freeze it. And you know, bare minimum, make their snacks healthy, right? Like the the little in between their meals, make those healthy, and then add some to the bowl as well, because they're super low calorie, they're at least getting the vitamins, micronutrients and fiber in its natural form. And you're giving them more of a palette too so that if you do get to a point where you can buy fresher food, they're going to taste it and and like it. Right. Well, Dr. Susie, I can't believe this. We're coming to an end here. But what is your take on rotating proteins? Yeah, I totally recommend rotating proteins. It's, you know, having been in pathology, studying some immunology, like how the immune system works, you need the… dogs bodies need exposure to different proteins, so that the antibodies in their body get used to them. Because if you keep a dog on one protein, its whole life, then all of a sudden switch to lamb. It could be okay, if they have digestive issues, that could be okay. But they could also have a reaction to that later because they've never been exposed to it. It's very similar to how people expose babies to different foods when they're young, right? You give them a little bit, wait a week, see what happens, you know, if they have a big reaction, then obviously, they can't have strawberries or whatever the food is. Same thing. You know, with younger dogs, I tell people, you know, if you can give them two or three different proteins, see how they tolerate it. That way their immune system is getting used to it and is balanced so that as they age, they're used to that. Yeah, that makes sense. And I totally agree, because every protein source has its unique amino acid profile. So just like us, we should be eating a variety as well. So I totally agree with you there. Well, Dr. Susie, thank you for all of this great information. Where can everybody find out more about you and your practice? Well, thank you so much for having me. It's been a pleasure. My website is the best place to reach me. It's www.drsuzee.com . Your Social Media URLs or Tags          Instagram: @drsuzee          Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/drsuzee/          LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/drsuzeecamilleri/ Okay, and all of this will be in the show notes. And Dr. Susie, you have clients all over the world, right? Pretty close to all over the world. Yeah, most are North American. But I do get a lot of calls from Europe because people are connecting now. And trying to connect with like minded people to find out what's the best for their dog. Well, I just think we're in a great place. changes are being made. New proteins are being developed without the slaughter. And I'm so excited to learn more about, you know, fungi, and insects are being introduced into food. There's just so many exciting things on the horizon. So I think changes are being made, which is really exciting. It is very exciting. And I'm looking forward to seeing what's what's going to happen. Yep. Well, thank you Dr. Suzee, for all you do. Appreciate you. Thanks so much. Take care. Again, thanks to the team at Dr. Harvey’s for sponsoring this episode. When you choose Dr. Harvey’s you and your dog benefit from over 30 years of research and experience. Keep your dog healthy and happy by checking out all of their amazing products at https://www.drharveys.com/ and don’t forget to get 10% off at checkout with code WOL10 Thanks for listening. You'll find some helpful links in the show notes and if you enjoy the show, please be sure to follow and listen for free on your favorite podcast app. And please, please share your feedback. Visit WagOutLoud.com for great product recommendations with discounts, amazing online events and fantastic resources. That's also where to visit our Bark About It page where you can suggest topics, guests or products. Be advised that this show offers health and nutritional information and is designed for educational purposes only. You're encouraged to do your own research and should not rely on this information as a substitute for nor does it replace professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. If you have any concerns or questions about your dog's health, you should always consult a veterinarian or a nutrition expert. Have a tail wagging day and we'll catch you next time. Hey Winston was that another tail wagging episode?

 Pet Health 5: A Monthly Dog Wellness Check | File Type: audio/mpeg | Duration: 00:34:40

Hello everyone, this is Krista with Episode #142 on the Wag Out Loud pawdcast. Because I'm going to be expanding my Wag Out Loud business with exciting things to come, I wanted to let you know that as of January 2022, I'm going to go from releasing weekly episodes to releasing bi monthly episodes. Putting the show on is super important to me, but to do it right, and all on my own, I've decided to bring you the same awesome guests and content, but just with a lesser frequency. And that's going to give me more time to work on other fantastic projects in the canine health and wellness space. So stay tuned for some exciting future announcements. Did you know that hotspots often occur in dogs with weakened immune systems? So once the skin is red and raw, it's primed for infection, which then creates a vicious cycle of itching, scratching and further trauma to the skin. What exactly is a hot spot? Well, it's an itchy, inflamed area of the skin that an affected dog obsessively scratches, licks and bites, which then creates an open sore. So treating hotspots involves not only healing the wound, but also finding and resolving the underlying cause to prevent reoccurrence. Welcome to the Wag Out Loud pawdcast, where we are obsessed with bringing you helpful tips on canine health care, nutrition, and overall wellbeing. If you'd like to support the show, check out the amazing online events, products and resources that I personally recommend on the Wag Out Loud website. I'm your host, Krista and I'm super excited to be bringing you yet another tail wagging episode. Jessica Shipman has been active in the pet industry as a blogger and influencer for 8+ years. She’s an All Pet Voices Co-Founder and BlogPaws Executive Team Member who is experienced in web development, content strategy, digital marketing, and project management. She’s passionate about making connections, bridging gaps, her dogs Luna and Ralph, and llamas. Chloe DiVita has a passion for pets and for business, and her dog Onyx. In 2009, she had the opportunity to combine those, when her mom and a couple of others started BlogPaws. Since that time, she has also co-founded All Pet Voices where her and Jessica create many forms of content for pets that educates, entertains, and inspires. Welcome dog lovers to yet another informative Wag Out Loud pawdcast episode. And today we have not one, but two experts on the show. We have Jessica Shipman and Chloe DiVita. And they are from All Pet Voices. And they're both going to be talking to us about Pet Health 5, a monthly dog wellness check. So you know, I'm all about wellness. So I'm excited to have this conversation. Ladies, thank you so much for being here. And I'm going to ask each of you to introduce yourselves and tell us why are you so passionate about canine health? Yeah, thank you, Krista. This is Chloe DiVita from All Pet Voices. And I've been in the pet industry now for goodness, since officially since 2009. But I actually had a dog blog that I started way back in 2006 that I kept up for a while that covered my Greyhound and her best friend that was a ferret. A lot of what I learned, you know, I feel like I kind of grew up in the online world and digital marketing. And it really brought, I think forward not only the passion for dogs and for pets in general, but also just for learning how to get more good quality information out there. So I love what you're doing Krista, with this podcast and I know Jessica and I both are super passionate about just making sure people know where to get good information, what good information is, and you know the options so that you can make the best educated decisions for the health of your dog. Absolutely. And I am Jessica Shipman. I am the other co founder of All Pet Voices. And I found my way into the pet industry when I adopted my first dog as an adult. I always grew up with dogs and cats. But right after college, I got my first dog accidentally signed up for Twitter saw that there is this whole digital community of pet lovers. You'll probably hear us mentioned BlogPaws. Chloe was one of the you know, initial team members there it is something that we are still continuing today. But that is kind of how we connected. I continued, you know, to grow my knowledge, and I grew up with dogs all the time, but it was very much you know, grocery store food treat things like that didn't even really realize until I had a dog of my own all the options that are out there. And I think that's something that Chloe and myself are a big proponent of is, you know, knowing the information, but also understanding that the right choice isn't the right choice for every person for every dog for every family. And so just knowing correct, you know, quality information is a big piece of it and that's one of the reasons why we started Pet Health 5, which I'm going to let Chloe talk a little bit about too. Yeah, I'm excited about this campaign that you ladies are starting. Yeah. And, you know, it comes from a passion we both have and things that we've seen out there, which is just sometimes, as pet parents, even though we want the best, and we want to provide the best, we don't always know the best. And that is broad, not just in food, but overall wellness. So nutrition is a piece of that for sure. But also just understanding like, the norms for your dog, just like any human who, you know, our rate, our temperature supposed to be 98.6, some of us run low, and some of us run high. And knowing that helps us know if we're off. And the same goes for our dogs. And so, you know, Jessica and I talk a lot about the health of our pets. Sure. We have a lot of discussions around what's going on with our dogs. Right, who's going to the vet this week? Oh, yes. So that it really kind of was born out of that is my dog in particular, I have a dog who has high blood pressure, atypical Addison's, IBD, a small intestinal disease. So many issues. And so staying on top of that, and just knowing when he's off a little bit is really important. So things like what his normal body temperature is, he actually runs low, he runs at 100.7. And most dogs are in the range of 101 to 102.5. But knowing that he runs low means that if I take his temp and I think he's off, and it's showing it like 102, that's high for him, it might be in the normal range. But for him, I know it's high. And that helps me gauge you know, how how to how I should I be taking action? Do I need to call the vet do I need to watch him actually keep a journal where I log things about what I see, so that if a trend emerges, I can go alright, something’s up. I need to call my vet. But I feel like as much as a lot of dog lovers want to have that, or would do that, if they knew they just don't aren't aware of what they should know. And what little signs might make a big difference for you to be able to act more quickly. Oh, my gosh, you have hit it on the head. And especially now that you know, through the pandemic, a lot of veterinarians were doing telemedicine, so the more that we can do at home and know our dogs and what seems out of line, you know, catching something early, it's being proactive, which I absolutely love. So, before we dissect the Pet Health 5, how is this campaign going to work? Yeah, Jessica, you start. All right, there's, there's aspects. Yeah, um, but the biggest component of it is that it is going to be a email signup. And so we're going to be sending out reminders monthly on the fifth of every month to remind you to do five things, and a bonus thing every month, that'll change. But five things the same five things every month, which we'll dissect in a little bit. And it's just that little nudge to, you know, get it done to take a few moments with your pet or multiple pets that you have? Sit down, examine them, be comfortable with them, have them be comfortable with you. But also I know, Krista, when we first met, one of the biggest things I felt like we bonded over was being an advocate for your dog, right? Like you are the one that knows your dogs the best. And so this is just going to help you get to know your dog even better. And just kind of a gentle reminder every month to you know, make sure you do it amongst all the other things that are busy in your life. Wow, what a great idea. And having us all on the same page, having the reminder, you know, it's just like we get reminders on the monthly breast exam. Okay, that's great. I, let's get it done. So you have five wellness checks in this monthly routine. And how long should this monthly check take each of us? So the idea is, that's why it's Pet Health 5. So on the fifth of the month, you're going to get your reminder email, we're hoping you take five minutes to just check these five things. And really, they should be fairly quick. they encompass doing a body scan, which you know, means looking at your dog from, you know, nose to tail, kind of taking a look to see if you see anything maybe like my dog just has warts. They're pretty harmless, but I just watch them and I know where they are and how many he has. So a new one pops up and go, Oh, there's another one. And it's just good to monitor those kinds of things. But also do a little bit of a feel, right? You want to feel your dog's body is there a new lump those kinds of things. You know, you want to check so, but it shouldn't take you more than you know, a minute or two to sort of take a look and feel over your dog and note down any thing that you you find or that you notice. So that's the first one, then you're also going to do a temperature check. You're going to check their weight, and you're going to check their teeth. So dental teeth, gum stuff, and then you're gonna check their heart rate. Most of this is observational, right? You're you're looking, you're just, obviously, you know how to take a dog temperature, although I will say, Krista, I don't know if you were at SuperZoo. But Jess and I were there and we met a company that is coming out with like, a, an under arm or under leg, I guess, thermometer to make it much easier. And it's, yeah, it's gonna be for consumers. But I don't think it's out yet. But it's coming. And we're really excited about that. Because, like having to put the thermometer in the back end… Yes, the usual spot. right, yeah, right. But you can honestly, my dog is so used to it, because we do this every month that he just gets a treat. And he sits there and he's fine, right. So it is one of those things that the more you do it, the more accustomed your dog gets to how you touch them and feel them, which can be another great training for when they are at the vet. And I think that's a big piece is that, you know, the goal is to be in that five minute timeframe, it might take a little bit longer the first time or two that you do it. But don't get discouraged, because you're going to become more comfortable, and your dog is going to become more comfortable. And then, you know, some of these things, they might sound pretty, you know, simple and things like that. But we're still going to provide you some tips on how to actually do them just like, you know, there may be some people out there that are like, Oh, how do I actually take a temperature of a dog if I've never done it before, you may not have experienced the back end. So we will also be providing some tips along the way, as well as creating some other great and you know, content health information for other questions that come up as well. Pure genius. Oh my gosh, you guys, well, we can all give five minutes a month, I think to enhance our dog's wellness. So we are going to take a break here shortly. But why don't we go over the first of the five wellness checks, and we talked about body scan. So I would assume we're talking, you know, just pay attention to their skin and coat. Is there dander? Are there fleas and ticks? Chloe, you mentioned lumps and bumps. could those be something? Could it just be an enlarged lymph node? And if that is the case, then obviously there's another underlying issue. Ears. I mean, I know ear infections smell awful. So just sniffing in your dog's ear and looking for inflammation. Eyes, are they clear? Are they gunky? Paws, spread your dog's paw because that's a common place for you know, allergy signs or sores. Make sure their nails are short, and I could go on and on just about this first one. Yeah, yep, and body scan. body scan is actually one even though we're going to be reminding you once a month to do it. I always like to recommend every time you're snuggling up with your dog just to you know, obviously you're petting them and you're ribbing them anyway so it's a great thing to do regularly even more so then once a month. But absolutely like I know my dog Ralph, he got into an incident with a neighboring dog and he actually has a scar on his nose and so I keep an eye on that to make sure that he you know, hasn't reopened it or done anything like that. Allergies, fleas and ticks, huge thing, especially depending on the area that you live in. Out here in Colorado, we are a little bit more fortunate that they're not as prominent, but back when I lived in Virginia, ticks were such a huge issue almost all the time. So definitely keep an eye on those. Love it. All right everybody. We are gonna take a quick commercial break and we will be back for your other for wellness checks… the tips that Chloe and Jessica are giving us so hold tight and we will be right back. Thanks to our sponsor of today’s episode, ABSC Organics, makers of the ABSC Pure Organic CBD Oil.  This is the ONLY CBD oil for pets that has been tested safe and effective in multiple clinical trials with the highly- respected Colorado State University Veterinary Medical School.  In a pretty much unregulated industry, you need to have trust in the CBD oil that you give to your four-legged family members.  Produced in the United States, each batch is tested for purity and CBD concentration and has been clinically proven to be safe and non-toxic.  These products have no psychoactive ingredients and ABSC Organics has many loyal customers, myself included, who use their CBD oil with their pets for years to relieve symptoms and improve quality of life.  I highly recommend these products and encourage you to go to check them out at www.petpainfree.com.  If your pet suffers from epileptic seizures, joint pain from osteoarthritis, or a host of other conditions, know that ABSC Organics uses their research to manufacture trustworthy products that provide symptomatic relief for pets. And don’t forget to use the code WAG15 to receive 15% off your first order! Well, we are back for part two with Jessica and Chloe talking about this absolutely brilliant program and campaign, the Pet Health 5, the monthly dog wellness check. And these ladies are going to make it as simple as possible to take five minutes, once a month to make sure that your dog is healthy and well. So we already went over number one, what a body scan might entail. Ladies, let's talk about heart rate, what should we do and look for as far as heart rate? So heart rate in in dogs is a little bit different. And we're in this is one of those places where we will give you in the email some information, right? So we're not just saying hey, check your heart rate, we're gonna explain how and we're gonna let you know like what you should be looking for. If you have a small breed if you have a large breed, because there is some differences. There can even be differences just breed, like breeds in general can have some differences. So we are going to provide, you know, information for you so you know where you're starting. But when it comes to heart rate, you know, the average rate, heart rate of a small dog is between 80 and 130 beats per minute. That's like a resting heart rate. Obviously, that will be one of the key things is you want to make sure you're doing this when your pet has been rested and not like after you just went for a half hour run. Right? So you know, that's that's definitely an aspect. But you know, if you're talking about a large dog, the average heart rate is between 60 and 100 beats per minute. So you'll definitely want to know, you know, when you're taking it if you're falling in that average, but it's just helpful to know what your dog's average is, you know, 60 to 100 is still a pretty wide range. Sure. So, every every month, you take your dog's heart rate when they're resting, and it's 60. And then one month, all of a sudden, that is 100. That's the reason for you to go wait a minute, you know, maybe I should check their heart rate for the rest of the day, every hour and see if it stays here. And if so you might call your vet and say I noticed this thing, right. And to me, to both of us, one of the things I think that's powerful about this campaign, and since signing up and having this is that ability to say to your vet, I noticed this, and I need to have a talk about it, because I'm worried it could be a problem. And your vet becomes more informed because you're more informed. This just helps with the relationship you have with your vet and with how your vet can help you with your pets’ health. Absolutely. And I assume you know, you can always get a baseline when you're at the veterinarian next time. Just ask, you know, what is normal for my dog? As far as heart rate or pulse? For sure. Yeah. And it's really you know, and we'll explain this. But it's actually pretty simple. You just need to have a clock with a timer so that you can time for 15 seconds and you put your heart or your hand over your dog's heart, usually the left side of their chest. And you just count how many beats in those 15 seconds you get. And then you multiply by four. And that's their heart rate for the minute. Interesting. And can you also do it in the femoral artery there on the rear leg? You can but depending on the breed, it could be harder to find. So usually the chest and because of the strength of the dog's heart, it's easier to feel it there. But you could, that is possible. Got it. Okay, awesome. Next one. Temperature. We were talking about that a little bit. Yeah, and this is another one that definitely varies between breeds between dogs, just like with humans, our temperatures aren't all the exact same. So it is a great place, like what Chloe was mentioning for her dog Onyx to really know what that baseline temperature is. And to understand even though the normal range for dogs can be anywhere from 101-102.5, you know, if your dog tends to be closer to 101, if they're at that higher end that could indicate that something is up and might be something that you want to bring up to your vet. And one of the things Chloe was mentioning is you know, it helps build that conversation, that relationship that you have with your vet, but I feel like generally when I go to the vet, they ask, you know, is everything okay? How are things going and unless there's something that's like you know, this is wrong. Sometimes I feel like I don't actually know unless I am doing these things I know that like their temperature has been consistent, their body scan has been good, their heart rate has been good. And then the other two things that are coming after this as well. But I think that really helps you also feel confident and like, yeah, things are good, or, you know, no, there's something going on. You know, let's check this out, let's have a conversation about it. But with temperature, we did you know, allude to earlier on that there is the more traditional rectal method of measuring your dog's temperature, we are excited that there are new things coming out to make that a little bit easier, a little bit more comfortable for all parties involved. And we'll of course, share more information about that on our emails as well. But that's pretty much what it is, is you're going to be sitting taking the temperature, it's also like Chloe was mentioning, make sure that it's not after you just went on a big hike or a run or anything, because you know, our temperatures are gonna raise as we are more active. And so that's the same with dogs as well. Right. So there’s the key components for temperature. I love it. And we have to remember that dogs, you know, they have this insulating layer of hair and fur when it's cold. But for them to stay cool is more difficult for them, because they don't have the same cooling system of sweat glands that we do. So we really need to watch for signs of heatstroke overheating, you know, the excessive panting, and so forth. But knowing how to take their temperature, you know, to gauge where they are. I love that. And I think too many of us with all of these five wellness checks, we just say, oh, you know, we'll have it done at the vet whenever we go next. But being on top of it at home, you both have said it many times, you know your own dog, you know when there's a red flag. So I just I'm so excited. I hope you can feel that. Yeah. Okay. On to number four. This is a biggie, literally. Weight. Yeah, wait. And I will say this is the one that depending on the size of your dog, could be a little bit more difficult. So if you have a really like, if you're talking about St. Bernard, or you know, a Newfie or something, you probably have to take them somewhere to weigh them, I don't think you're going to be picking them up. So there is that I will, I will say that. But I also know that like at least here and I've heard this for other places, you know, we're in Denver, Colorado, but I know your vet has a scale right in their office. And most vets will let anyone go in and just weigh their pet, and just walk in and put your pet on a scale, there's also a lot of local groomers will have a scale that they'll let you go in and use. So chances are if you have a larger breed dog, there is a place within you know, pretty close to you that you could just pop in. And maybe it's a different stop once a month, because you know, you just do that. But if you wanted to kind of keep an eye on that on your dog's weight, that is a way you can do it. I am lucky enough that my little dog here, I mean, he weighs 38 pounds. So he's not tiny, but he can be picked up. So you just take your weight. Yeah, pick up your dog stand on the scale. Now you have a total weight. Obviously, their weight is total weight minus your weight. Correct? Exactly. So easy. Math. Everybody can do it. Yeah. So it is it is possible. This is serious, because you probably know, over half of all the dogs in the United States are overweight or obese. Yep. So this is a telltale sign of so many different health issues. Diabetes, heart problems, arthritis. So this is crucial for us to understand what the proper weight versus an obese or overweight dog looks like. And I know there's in addition to actually weighing your dog, what are some other ways that we can look at that indicate proper weight versus overweight? We will be talking about in our email, you know, the rib test. You know, as you as you feel your dog because that was one of the hard things if you have a big fluffy dog, they can gain some weight and hide it pretty well, because they're big and fluffy anyway, right? So you always want to you know, as you're feeling your dog along their ribs, you should be able to feel the ribs without them protruding, right protruding is too skinny, but you should be able to sort of gently go along the side and tell that there are ribs there and kind of be able to count them. There is a visual that a lot of vets will put up in their office that kind of shows the scale right there, like rate your pets from like, you know, like one to eight or something I forget the full range. But, you know, you want this sort of gauge where you're looking down at them over the top. And you can see that from the ribcage to their abdomen, it comes in a little bit, there's that little… They have waistline. Your dog should have a little waist. And then you just want to make sure again, you know, not protruding, but you can feel the ribs if you can't feel ribs, there's way too much stuff between your finger and the rib. And it's not fur. There's another way that you can look from the side. And if your dog's abdomen is lower than or the same level as their chest, right. Oh my gosh, that is an overweight dog. So yeah, just by looking …not, good, everybody. So when they're looking at you with those puppy dog eyes, they don't need all those treats. Don't let your dog do that. Because you're doing a disservice when it comes to weight. Well, I like to encourage like people, Krista, I know you're big on this too. And just I kind of laugh at some of the things that we give our dogs but like, stop giving them a treat, maybe give them a piece of broccoli. Or a blueberry. You're right. Yeah, exactly. Yes. You know. Yeah. And I think that will be part of it, too, is like, you know, we mentioned that there'll be one sort of new thing each month. So there's always going to be these five things, we're going to send you a checklist, we're just going to send you the ability to have a log, we know some people like to do it digitally. Some like to have something printed, however you want to keep track of it is fine. But we will give you a log in case you would like something given to you. Because that's what becomes amazing to have six months down the line, about six months of logs of these things that you can actually show your vet and say, Look, I've been keeping track, Everything's been great. Or, you know, we had a month that was kind of off, maybe it's gotten better, maybe it's not, but you just want to have that discussion with them to see if there's anything you should be worrying about. Because maybe, maybe they lost a little weight. You can't explain why. Right. You know, and that's important to note as well. So we're gonna have all that in there. And then in addition, every month will have something in there so like February's dental health month, we'll probably go a little bit more in depth about dental health. As summer comes around, we'll probably talk about heatstroke and what to look out for right there'll be something related to sort of a season or the month, that sort of continues to educate everybody on things you can just look for at home. Perfect. Well, speaking of dental, as we're about to wrap up here, the fifth wellness check is teeth and gums. So could one of you walk us through what we should be looking for? Yeah, absolutely. So, as with all of these, you're going to want to look for the baseline. Depending on how old and how rigorous you are about, you know your dog's dental health. Now, there may be already some existing plaque and tartar, discolorations, things like that. So you're gonna want to create that baseline have a you know, understanding of what color your dog's teeth are, what color their gums are, and then continue to check that if there are discolorations, make sure that they don't change get bigger get worse. You're also going to want to look for the health of your dog's overall teeth. Notice if there's any cracks or breakage or splitting or the teeth are starting to change significant colors. And then of course, you're going to want to look at the whole mouth as well as make sure there aren't any sores. Look at their tongue. I know my dog, Ralph has a mostly pink tongue, but he has a big black spot in the middle of it. So I always keep an eye on that making sure that it's, you know, it's still the same black spot as it's always been, but really looking at gums, teeth, their mouths and their tongue. Yeah. And breath is a major sign. Puppy breath is not a good thing. That means that there is infection, inflammation, possibly abscesses. So you ladies are hitting the nail on the head. Because we know that periodontal disease affects other organs in the body. overall health does start in the mouth and people listening know why I am not a huge fan of kibble. You know, it's a dry processed food. And so many dogs fed that diet are really in a state of dehydration. So there's a way that you can even check your dog's gums. For you know, if your finger can slide over the gums and glide easily, then there's enough moistness and they are hydrated. But if not, if it's sticky or tacky, then that could indicate dehydration so you can address it, then. Yeah. And being like in your dog's mouth, it might be the first couple of times, it might be an experience for both of you. But it is something that again, will get easier with time. It is important. I know the very first time after I had Ralph, and I took him to the vet. And I found out after that, that he actually had a cracked tooth. And I felt terrible, because that meant that I wasn't looking at him close enough. And he had been living with this tooth for who knows how long, right? And so I think it is super important to actually get up in there and look, and both of you feel comfortable with what's going on. And you know, while you're there, doesn't hurt to maybe do a little bit of brushing. It doesn't hurt at all. That's what we should be doing. Just yeah, 30 seconds a day. And you're so right, because when you're brushing your dog's teeth, you will see if there is something going on, it's a great time, not just monthly, we're talking daily. Well, ladies, I am so excited and grateful to you for putting this you know, it's like an aha moment. Why didn't this exist to begin with? Yeah, exactly. So where can everybody find out more information about you two, All Pet Voices, and this new campaign that you're putting into place the Pet Health 5? So definitely. We are @AllPetVoices in all of the places. And our website is Allpetvoices.com And this is going to be launching here mid November. So you're going to if you go to that site, you cannot miss Pet Health 5.          Instagram: @allpetvoices          Facebook: @allpetvoices     TWITTER:  @allpetvoices Okay, perfect. And all of these links to find Allpetvoices.com, is going to be in the show notes as well as the URL. Ladies, this has been wonderful. And I'm so excited that you created this program, any parting words? I think really, what I just want to encourage everybody is that we you are the advocate for your dog. And the more you know, the better choices you can make. And the better discussions you can have with your vet and the more in control you can feel of your dog's health. So something like this is really just meant to help guide you there. And I just want to encourage everybody to, you know, not only sign up for the program, so they get that reminder and do the things to keep those logs and have the conversations because everybody your pet, you, everybody will be in better health, both physically and mentally and emotionally. If you just are in a little bit more control and have a little bit more knowledge. Absolutely. Jessica? Yeah. Chloe nailed it. And I just want to say thank you so much for having us here today. And I think we all have the same goal to improve lives of our dogs, but also dogs everywhere. And I think this is a step forward in that direction. I agree. Well, thank you, both of you for being here. We appreciate you. Everybody, go to Allpetvoices.com. And sign up for free for these monthly reminders for Pet Health 5. Thanks, ladies. Thank you. Again, thanks to ABSC Organics, makers of the ABSC Pure Organic CBD Oil for sponsoring this episode. I highly recommend these products and encourage you to go to check them out at www.petpainfree.com.  If your pet suffers from epileptic seizures, joint pain from osteoarthritis, or a host of other conditions, know that ABSC Organics uses their research to manufacture trustworthy products that provide symptomatic relief for pets. And don’t forget to use the code WAG15 to receive 15% off your first order! Thanks for listening. You'll find some helpful links in the show notes and if you enjoy the show, please be sure to follow and listen for free on your favorite podcast app. And please, please share your feedback. Visit WagOutLoud.com for great product recommendations with discounts, amazing online events and fantastic resources. That's also where to visit our Bark About It page where you can suggest topics, guests or products. Be advised that this show offers health and nutritional information and is designed for educational purposes only. You're encouraged to do your own research and should not rely on this information as a substitute for nor does it replace professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. If you have any concerns or questions about your dog's health, you should always consult a veterinarian or a nutrition expert. Have a tail wagging day and we'll catch you next time. Hey Winston was that another tail wagging episode?

 Access to Veterinary Care: A National Family Crisis | File Type: audio/mpeg | Duration: 00:35:42

Hi everyone, This is Krista with Episode #141. On the Wag Out Loud pawdcast. I am so excited to share with you that I'm going to be expanding my Wag Out Loud business, with lots of exciting things to come. I wanted to let you know that as of January 2022, I'm going to go from releasing weekly episodes to releasing bi monthly episodes. Putting the Show on is so important to me. But to do it right, and all on my own, I've decided to bring you the same awesome guests and content, but just with a lesser frequency. That's going to give me more time to work on other fantastic projects and the canine health and wellness space. So stay tuned for some exciting future announcements. I am begging everybody. Please restrain your pup while traveling in your car. According to the pet advocacy group, Bark Buckle Up, a 60 pound dog in a car traveling just 35 miles an hour can turn into a 2700 pound projectile in an accident. So please play it safe and make sure your dog is secured in a crash tested crate or buckle them up via an appropriate harness either in the backseat or for smaller dogs in an appropriate booster seat. Let's ensure that your dog doesn't become one of these statistics. Welcome to the Wag Out Loud pawdcast, where we are obsessed with bringing you helpful tips on canine health care, nutrition, and overall wellbeing. If you'd like to support the show, check out the amazing online events, products and resources that I personally recommend on the Wag Out Loud website. I'm your host, Krista and I'm super excited to be bringing you yet another tail wagging episode. Dr. Michael Blackwell had a doctorate of veterinary science as well as a masters in public health. He directs the Program for Pet Health Equity at the University of Tennessee, chairs the Access to Veterinary Care Coalition, and serves as a member of the HSVMA Board of Directors. In the past he has served as dean of the College of Veterinary Medicine at the University of Tennessee, the chief of staff at the Office of the Surgeon General of the U.S., the deputy director of the Center for Veterinary Medicine at the Food and Drug Administration, and the chief veterinary officer of the U.S. Public Health Service and The Humane Society of the United States. During 23 years of active duty, he achieved the rank of Assistant Surgeon General of the U.S Public Health Service Commissioned Corps. He has owned two private practices and has received numerous awards and recognitions. Hello dog lovers. Today we are going to learn something new as we chat with Dr. Michael Blackwell, about access to veterinary care, a national family crisis. Dr. Blackwell, thank you so much for being here. I've been looking forward to this interview. And everybody's going to be blown away about all that you do. So if you could introduce yourself, and tell us why you have such a heart for providing veterinary care for underserved families. Well, certainly thank you for the opportunity to join you with on this podcast and share information with your audience. Yes, Dr. Michael Blackwell. I'm the director of the program for pet health equity at the University of Tennessee. And our mission is to improve access to veterinary care for underserved families. It's a huge societal crisis that we have and such important work. We often hear about access to health care with respect to human members of the family, but not as much about the non human members. And so we need to catch up in this work. And I'm just so thrilled to be doing it. You must have a huge heart and I can't wait for everybody to learn about the program. So why don't we start with statistics. So according to a study from the University of Tennessee's College of Social Work, and the Access to Veterinary Care Coalition, 28% of households reported having barriers to veterinary care in the past two years. So money being the biggest factor and the study also estimated more than 29 million pets live in homes that rely on SNAP benefits, or food stamps. Can I first ask what are SNAP benefits? Yes, SNAP is an acronym for the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program, formerly known as the food stamp program. So many of our families rely on public assistance in the form of food stamps, I do want to hasten to say we are having to overcome a bias about the people who need assistance. The bias is many might think that these are people who are irresponsible if they just worked harder or went out and got a job, they wouldn't be needing help. But the truth of the matter is the largest percentage of these folks do contribute. They do work, but they're paid such low wages that they can't support the family without some assistance. So we use that measure because if you qualified for the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program or SNAP, then you probably are not walking into a veterinary clinic paying for veterinary care. And so that was thought to be pretty sound measure or estimate of the size of the problem. Sure. Well, and you and I both know, in this day and age, so many more dogs are not only getting cancer, but all of the other diseases associated with the lifestyle and toxins in our environment, that I mean, even people with means more and more of us are having to face the fact of an awful diagnosis or a surgery or what have you. And it could be so expensive. And it's expensive to have pet insurance as well. So I can't even imagine having a dog where I would have to make a life or death decision, all based on my financial means. Yes. You know, in, in that situation, everybody loses. Let's start with the individual who needs medical care. And then let's look 360 degrees around that pet and see the pet’s people. And we see the veterinary care team that wants to help, that lose, and then our communities lose. Because if we're not preventing and controlling zoonotic diseases, those diseases that an animal can pass on to a human, then our communities are at risk as well. It's a very, very difficult and important situation that must be addressed. And we think it can be, but we need to intend to fix that. You, a few years ago, you did a lot of research in this area. So can you share what your findings are? Yes. And let's start with the stats that you just shared. More than one out of four families reported a barrier to veterinary care in the previous two years. That is, as bad as that number is, things have gotten worse since COVID-19. You know, there are still individuals who are unemployed or not fully employed as they were before the pandemic. So the numbers have worsened, the problem has worsened. We wanted to understand those barriers. And as you pointed out, the biggest one is finances. But there are some others. And these pet owners, a very important stat is 88% of the respondents consider their pet a family member. And interestingly, the veterinarians that were surveyed, about the same percentage considered the pets family members. And the veterinarians, with 90% believe that when these pets do not get veterinary care that there are emotional impacts, negative impacts upon the pet’s family. And so we wanted to characterize the problem with an initial study. And of course, our work has continued since then, that Access to Veterinary Care Coalition wanted to understand better what these barriers are. And let me just point this out, you know, in animal welfare work, and in veterinary medicine, we are historically very pet centric or animal centric in our thinking in our activities. But when we talk about barriers to medical care, the pets don't present the barriers. The barriers are human derived human factors. I point that out because both the veterinary medicine industry or profession and animal welfare industry need to broaden our scope so that we understand we've got to like the people well enough to help them because that is the way by which we're going to help the the pets, the individuals we want to reach. Sure, that makes sense. Well, I know you've talked about the data and what it looks like for bonded families versus the health metrics with non-bonded families. Can you talk a little bit about that? Yes. And just as a reminder, we coined the term bonded family, or bonded family in order to be more precise about who it is we're talking about. so bonded means, families that have animals. Bond bonded families are the ones where there is truly an emotional bond between the humans and the non human members of that family. In other words, the human animal bond And so we thought that it was important to be clear that these families are very much deserving of support because of those emotional impacts. And so previous studies and our own work that's ongoing shows that humans benefit from these relationships. And the benefits are both psychological and physiological or physical. We know that, for example, people with pets are more physically active, especially with with dogs, because they take them out for a walk, they're more socially engaged, less depression, and anxiety is measured less stress. Our recent work shows that these families, these bonded families, report a higher rate of happiness, if you would, and well being. So in summary, there, there's some work that's been done. And we need to continue to do the work to better understand why we humans are healthier or better off when we're in these relationships. And this then gets back to the fact that helping the animals means understanding what's going on with, in this case, the pet’s' people. These benefits, by the way do translate into economics. So for example, the very people who struggled to pay for needed services don't need to be getting sick. There are people who struggled to access health care for the humans don't need to be getting sick. And if the pets are helping them to stay healthier, man, don't we want to make sure that that they are able to have that relationship. And so we take the position, we don't believe you should be denying a relationship with another. Period. But in this case, denying the relationship with a pet because of finances. In that the end of the day. It's more costly for the family. It is more costly for our nation. When families are unhealthy, human members are unhealthy. Well, I just want to let everybody know that Dr. Blackwell is behind this whole concept because you have both a Doctorate of Veterinary Science, you are a veterinarian, as well as a Master's in Public Health. So those two married together brings us to this program and this cause. And to your point, the lack of veterinary care impacts not only our pets and ourselves as the pet family, the veterinary care team and the community. So I love how you are trying to address all of these areas. So what we are going to do is take a quick sponsor break and then why don't we dive into this program for Pet Health Equity, and how you foresee making an impact on veterinary care, so we'll be right back. We are so grateful to the Original Mine Pet Platter for sponsoring this episode. This has to be one of my favorite products ever!  The Mine Pet Platter is designed to benefit the health and well-being of your dog and promotes the ultimate natural feeding experience for both meals and treats.  What is it?  Well, it’s a patented, bone shaped platter designed for your dog’s feeding instincts.  It includes scoops and ridges that naturally slows your dog’s eating routine and makes mealtime fun.  After watching my dog Winston slow down instead of inhale his food from a bowl, we’ve never gone back.  Now he explores, sniffs, paces, walks around the platter and licks it clean!  Its BPA free, made in the USA, dishwasher safe, sustainable, recyclable and has a 100% money back guarantee.  There are too many benefits to fit into this ad, so I encourage you to learn more by going to https://minepetplatter.com/ and learn that how you feed your dog is just as important as what you feed them.  And as a bonus, Wag Out Loud listeners can take advantage of a 10% discount by using the code WOL10 at checkout!

 SIT, STAY, HEAL - How Dogs and People Help Each Other | File Type: audio/mpeg | Duration: 00:33:04

Hello, this is Krista with Episode #140. On the Wag Out Loud pawdcast. I am so excited to announce that I'm going to be expanding my Wag Out Loud business with exciting things in store. I wanted to let you know that as of January 2022, I'm going to go from releasing weekly episodes to releasing bi monthly episodes. Putting the show on is so important to me, but to do it right, and all on my own, I've decided to bring you the same awesome guests and content, but just with a lesser frequency. That will give me more time to work on other fantastic projects in the canine health and wellness space. So stay tuned for some exciting future announcements. According to the experts at Wisdom Health, all dogs have a unique way of expressing love. But there are five common ways our dogs communicate love through body language and behavior. They are happy tail wagging, which shows that your dog is relaxed and happy. Licking, which is a sign of affection passed down from wolves. Leaning or sitting on you, following you around, because they just want to be close and playing with you. Our pups have tons of love to give. Welcome to the Wag Out Loud pawdcast, where we are obsessed with bringing you helpful tips on canine health care, nutrition, and overall wellbeing. If you'd like to support the show, check out the amazing online events, products and resources that I personally recommend on the Wag Out Loud website. I'm your host, Krista and I'm super excited to be bringing you yet another tail wagging episode. Carol Novello is the founder of Mutual Rescue™ and author of “Mutual Rescue: How Adopting a Homeless Animal Can Save You, Too.”  Mutual Rescue is a national initiative that highlights the connection between people and pets to inspire and support life-saving efforts in communities across the nation and world. Mutual Rescue’s short films have gone viral around the globe and collectively been viewed more than 150 million times. Welcome dog lovers to a another tail wagging episode of the Wag Out Loud pawdcast. And joining us today is Carol Novello. And she is here to chat about how dogs and people help each other. Carol, thank you so much for being here today. May I ask you to introduce yourself and tell us why you started Mutual Rescue? Thanks, Krista. It's a delight to be on the podcast today. Mutual Rescue came about because when I got involved in animal welfare, people would sometimes ask me why I was helping animals when I could be helping people. I thought that was a very curious question, because I know how much animals have helped me in my own life. And I was running a large animal welfare organization. And I was seeing every day, how adopting animals was helping the people that were welcoming them into their family. And so Mutual Rescue came about because I really wanted to elevate the cause of animal welfare and put it on par with other human related causes. Because when you're helping animals, you actually are helping people. And Mutual Rescue had great success with our first film, Eric and Peety. And I can talk a little bit more about that. But the success of that led to the opportunity to create more short films. And it also led to the opportunity to write a book called Mutual Rescue: How Adopting a Homeless Animal Can Save You Too. So I'm really excited about the work that we're doing to change the hearts and minds of people everywhere and really to advance animal services into the integration of human services so that we can continue to help each other in new and profound ways. I love it. Wow. Well, you mentioned the book, Mutual Rescue. So in the book, you gave some really interesting statistics, that we are a nation that's plagued by illness that we all know that 16 million adults suffer from depression, 29 million from diabetes, 8 million at any given time they have PTSD, and that nearly 40% of us are obese. And I was shocked to see that 60% of doctors said that they prescribe pet adoption, and 97% believe that pet ownership provides health benefits. That is amazing. Wow! Yeah, it's pretty exciting. That was a specific survey that was done to physicians and out of that survey, those were the percentages, which is really pretty amazing. And in fact, Eric and Peety, our first Film is a story about an obese man. And he was told by one doctor that if he didn't change his lifestyle, he was going to be dead in five years. And he subsequently found his way to a naturopathic doctor. And the very first thing that she recommended to him that she prescribed to him was to go adopt a shelter dog. And she did that for a couple of reasons. One was, she wanted him to walk the dog for at least 30 minutes a day. So that was one thing, there definitely was a physical exercise component to it. But she also saw that Eric was very isolated, very lonely, and really saw that he needed a connection, and support. And that's exactly what Peety did for him. And it's amazing the transformation that they both went through because he was, was overweight when Eric adopted him, and they both lost a lot of weight. And Eric went on to run a marathon. And it really, truly transformed his life. And he credits that all to Peety. So on the one hand, you hear those numbers, like, you know, wow, 60% of doctors prescribe pet adoption. 97% believe that pets have benefits. And then you see stories like this, and it all kind of makes sense. It's astonishing, really. I totally agree. And we've mentioned this on the show many times that, you know, our dogs, of course, we consider them family. But if you really think about it, they are so much more, they are our therapists and our doctors, and they bring so much to our lives. And I guess if there's any silver lining out of the whole pandemic, that it was more and more people realized that this was a great time to adopt a pet. You know, during difficult times, you heard that so many shelters were actually empty. So I think more and more of us are realizing, you know, the show is, of course, specifically about dogs, how they enrich and enhance our lives. Well, it's really amazing in all areas of our lives too, I think is what's really so fantastic that the book is divided into four chapters, heart, body, mind, and connection. And each of those sections, excuse me, there's about into four sections. And within those sections are numerous chapters that talk about the impact of animals on those particular aspects of our life. So in the heart section, it talks about building trust, and courage and resilience and overcoming grief. In body it talks about heart health, and, and weight, how to manage, you know, anxiety and the roles that animals can play in that. In mind, it talks about depression, and resilience and the things that we need to do to stay mentally healthy. And then connection is about our social relationships, and how dogs can help foster connections, not just with, you know, animals, to humans, but also how animals help us connect to other people. And I think that is, is a really special aspect of what they do for us as well. So what the book talks about is not just stories, but it also brings in the science, and the research that documents it. So it's fun, because you know, you'll read a story. And then there's a you may identify with yourself in that story or someone you know, and then there's the research that helps explain what's actually you know, going on in your body for what it is that you're experiencing. And one of the great things about animals is that they can help release, feel good chemicals in our bodies, so oxytocin, serotonin, prolactin, those kinds of feel good chemicals. There's a biological change in your body when you're having a positive interaction with your pet. And what's really fun is that there's been research done on dogs that shows that dogs are having the same experience when they're interacting with humans. They're, they're having that same release of biochemical hormones. So it definitely goes both ways. They, they love us as much as we love them. Yes, absolutely. Well, I tried to think of all the ways that dogs do benefit our lives. And I wanted to know if, if I can just make some statements and you and I can unpack those, because there is a lot of research and science. So dogs make us feel less alone. How do they support in that? Yeah, I think it gets back to what I was just talking about in terms of the release of those feel good chemicals. Because you know, when you are depressed or you're feeling alone, your biochemistry, there are certain chemicals that are coursing through your body. And when you have an opportunity to interact with an animal, you're getting again, this, this release of feel good chemicals, and it's changing your biochemistry, it helps you feel less alone. It feels like, you know, there's somebody in your corner. And, you know, I wholeheartedly agree with that statement. And I know that there was a survey done by the Human Animal Bond Research Institute, and they found that 85% of respondents believe that interaction with pets does reduce loneliness. So I thought that was very interesting. Yeah, I mean, it's the people that are having the experience will tell you they feel that. Yes, exactly. Dogs are good for your heart. Yeah, absolutely. And Eric and Peety, that film that I mentioned, is a great example of that. They help your heart in a variety of different ways. Help, they can help lower blood pressure, they can help motivate you to want to take more walks, or be more physically active, like Eric was. And it's really interesting, the American Heart Association, you know, did some research and they issued a statement where they said, you know, that dogs may actually help reduce heart disease, which is a pretty big deal for an organization of that stature to actually come out with that kind of claim. And I think that's a pretty good checkmark in the pro column for having a dog. I agree. All right, what about dogs help you to stop stressing out? Well, I know for me that one of the things I appreciate most about the dogs I've had in my life is how much they caused me to be grounded in the present moment. You know, they really keep me focused on the here and now. So that's, you know, my own personal experience. But one of the things that is very interesting is some of the research that's been done around this, they've actually looked at scenarios where they've asked people, they've done it with both math tests, as well as doing word problems. And they broke the people up into three groups and the first group, they were people that had their pets with them while they took the test. The second group did not have their animals with them, but they were asked to think about their pets in the context of while they were taking this test. And then the third group was just told to think about some random person while they were taking the test. And what was so interesting was that both groups, both of the animal groups where the animals were present, or whether they were just thinking about the animals, their blood pressure, did not spike as much it returned to normal much more quickly after the test was over, they were more likely to perceive the test as being a challenge rather than a threat in terms of how it felt to them. And even more amazingly, people got more answers, right. And so not only do dogs kind of keep us from stressing out, you know, by minimizing stress, or helping us cope better with stress that makes us “smarter”. I think because we are diverting our attention in ways that take away from our ability to solve problems. That makes sense. And to that point, I don't know if this is the same study, but this was Washington State University, they pretty much showed that dogs lower blood pressure, heart rate, they slow your breathing, they relax your muscle tension. And this all happens within just 10 minutes of petting a dog. That is the impact. And as you mentioned before, of course, a much higher reduction in cortisol, which is the major stress hormone. So it's just fascinating, and I can't believe that we're already halfway through Carol. We are going to take a quick sponsor break and we will be right back. Sounds good. Thanks so much to our friends at Primalhealth for sponsoring this episode.  They are the makers of TEEF Protektin42: Drinkable Dental Health for our dogs. Now this is a product that I can get behind! With over 80% of dogs over the age of three having active dental disease, it’s crucial that we get ahead of this condition. TEEF is a patented 100% nontoxic prebiotic formula that promotes protective bacteria to neutralize dangerous bacteria, even below the gum line. It’s a human-grade, safe and clinically-proven powder that is easily added to your dog’s drinking water. It promotes clean teeth, healthy gums and fresh breath!” What are you waiting for?  Order yours today by going to TEEFhealth.com and use the code WOLP to receive 20% off of your order!

 Dog Tricks Save Lives! | File Type: audio/mpeg | Duration: 00:35:04

Hello everyone, this is Krista with Episode #139 on the Wag Out Loud pawdcast. Because I'm going to be expanding my Wag Out Loud business with exciting things in store, I wanted to let you know that as of January 2022, I will go from releasing weekly episodes to bi monthly episodes. Putting this show on is super important to me, but to do it right, and all on my own, I've decided to bring you the same awesome guests and content, but just with a lesser frequency. So that will give me more time to work on other fantastic projects in the canine health and wellness space. So stay tuned for some exciting future announcements. Did you know this? Dogs recognize that when you leave, your home is full of your scent. And the longer you are gone, the more your smell dissipates. So if you have a regular routine, your dog will learn that at a certain scent level, you will return home. How amazing is that? Welcome to the Wag Out Loud pawdcast, where we are obsessed with bringing you helpful tips on canine health care, nutrition, and overall wellbeing. If you'd like to support the show, check out the amazing online events, products and resources that I personally recommend on the Wag Out Loud website. I'm your host, Krista and I'm super excited to be bringing you yet another tail wagging episode. Larry Kay is a best-selling dog author and award-winning dog filmmaker with two million Facebook fans at Positively Woof. Larry's keynote speeches, workshops, and Dog Hugs video podcast emphasize his passion for dog tricks, positive dog training, animal rescue, and celebrating our human-animal bond.  Welcome dog lovers to a another amazing episode of the Wag Out Loud pawdcast. I have no doubt that today's guest is going to teach us a few new tricks. We have Larry Kay with us who is a best selling and award winning dog author and dog filmmaker. Yay! Larry, thanks again for being on the show. Would you please introduce yourself and tell us how you got into trick training and filmmaking with shelter dogs? Krista, thanks so much for having me on your show. Yeah, the way I would typically introduce myself is I am Larry Kay, best selling dog author and award winning dog filmmaker with 2 million Facebook fans at Positively Woof. And, you know, as I thought about getting ready to come on your show today, and I know you like to have your guests introduce themselves. I think what would really give context to my background and how I got here is to say that I was at a crossroads in my career in media. I've always been a writer and producer of Creative Media. And I was mostly known in children's media. That's where I had really developed a reputation throughout the 1990s. And working with Disney and the Muppets. I wrote TV cartoons for the Pink Panther. I was trained at Hanna Barbera. And in fact, the late Bill Hanna was one of my mentors. Wow. So I and I taught filmmaking also at NYU and have a graduate degree in television and from Syracuse University. So I was at this crossroads since like, what's next I'm kind of done with the kids thing I was my my marriage of my long term marriage had broken up and my passion had drained out of my career, which was just as scary as being alone. And it was time to reinvent myself. And so I first did a project created a children's DVD that remember those things? that would teach the little ones, preschoolers how to be safe and successful around dogs. And it has puppetry and animation and original songs and good lessons, all these kinds of things that I got good at in the children's space and did it in the dog space. And at the end of the project, which ended up it's called Animal Wow. it's out of print. You can't even find it anymore. Yeah, I'll probably release it at some point in this thing called the cloud. And I loved the dog thing so much. It's like, I gotta do more of that. How can I do it? So I think I want to, I brought to the space, my background in filmmaking and long form writing and was fortunate enough to be able to do some excellent books. And given that filmmaker’s bend, I really knew that there was a way to bring filmmaking to the dogs and bring dogs to filmmaking not that other people haven't done before. But what's the place where I can make a contribution? Sure. And I got really passionate about shelter dogs. And so, um, you know, we've heard the conversation that shelter dogs, homeless dogs, used dogs, as I like to call them, you know, are somehow less than, and I like to take a seeming liability and flip it around. So that where's the hidden asset? How might they be really cool? in a special way that non shelter dogs are cool. So what is inside of every homeless dog? There's this undiscovered movie star. Then just thinking of this project, Dog Rescue Stars, trick training and filmmaking with homeless dogs. In order to get Yeah, in order to get them the best kind of stardom. A loving home forever. Oh Larry! I am so excited to dive into this. So you are going to cover dog tricks save lives. Yeah. And Larry, is it true that the most common reason that owners abandon their dogs is for behavioral issues? Yeah, yeah. It's, you know, I call it lack of training. And you're right, it's behavioral issues and they're correctable, two biggest ones are for people giving up on dogs are soiling the house. And chewing and barking. Those are the biggest reasons, all of which are correctable. Right. It's just these people didn't give them a chance. Yeah. And I get it. It's, you know, sometimes it's really hard. I've had my butt kicked by shelter dogs more than once, where, where I'm ready to give up. But I just know that it's like, okay, what can I do? And I just keep working at it. And suddenly it clicks. It's like, wow, got another one. Well, why don't you tell us a little bit about this Dog Rescue Stars program from start to finish? What does that look like? Sure. What is it a workshop. It was supposed to start last year before the pandemic. And, yeah, I've been designing it for a number of years. And it's basically trick training and moviemaking with shelter dogs, you know, I'm developing also the workshop for pet dogs. And we'll be piloting it here in Los Angeles. And my sweet spot is to is going into shelters to do this with dogs who are needing a home. So the full workshop is two and a half days. And I also do a single day workshop as well. And it attracts volunteers to take the workshop, trainers and filmmakers. And what shelter wouldn't want to have volunteer trainers and volunteer artists come in and volunteer at their shelter? Sure. So by showing those categories of folks this pretty cool and in some ways very easy way to train dogs and get them rescued, get them hopefully homes, it becomes not a burden on the shelter or local rescue organization. But instead it increases the pool of resources brings in fresh blood, more trainers, more artists and in the products that they create ie the films and other social media. It attracts more adopters and more resources. Plus it not only gets the dogs adopted, it helps the local rescue organization, but it also adds to the conversation, transforms the conversation of how cool rescue dogs are. How inside of every rescue dog is this undiscovered star. And it's our job as the talent agents, we’re the detectives to figure out this puzzle. It's a win, win for all really. Yeah, well the dog too. Well, exactly. the volunteers this is all live going on live, or is this a pre recorded workshop? It's a live in person workshop. And I've been developing it for some five plus years, I started this project before I wrote The Big Book of Tricks for the Best Dog Ever. And it was what inspired me to write that book and bring on Chris Perondi, who's a master stunt dog performer, as a co author. And from Chris, I learned all kinds of stuff about trick trading. We're gonna get into some tricks too here today. So everybody stay tuned for that. Larry, did you tell me before that you have had 80 shelter dogs go through this program that were successfully adopted already? Yeah. Including one very unruly Australian Cattle Dog, who when he first came to the set, you could barely touch him. He was scary. And this dog had a history. He’d been adopted twice and given up on twice. And this Australian Cattle Dog, you know, was basically on death row, and it might have been three strikes and you’re out. But fortunately, this shelter Pet Orphans here in Van Nuys, a part of Los Angeles pulled this dog off of death row and gave him the perfect name for a scary dog. Spider. Well, when Spider and 11 other dogs were presented to my film set, and we began making the film, you know, Spider could just barely sit still for five seconds. I mean, you just couldn't touch him. And so while the most of the other dogs, you know, they could sit and stay and even learned a few tricks. Naturally, almost all those dogs got adopted later. But a month later, nobody had come for Spider. So I began to volunteer to walk him. And little by little, he began to open up to me. So he looked at me instead of avoiding eye contact. So when he looked at me, I began to shake with some hand signals. And I introduced him to the agility course, which he loved. And he smiled. So I decided I was up for a really big challenge Krista. I brought Spider home forever. He now knows more than 50 dog tricks. That's amazing. When I first adopted Spider, our veterinarian needed three vet techs, just to examine him. Now, we perform dog tricks in the waiting room. I love it. And and she says he's a completely different dog. You know, so trick training transformed Spider’s life. You know, it made him sociable. And it certainly built our bond. And I believe that trick training can do that for every dog that there is a trick or tricks for just about every dog. Okay, well, Larry, we are going to take a quick commercial break, and we are going to come back and get into trick training. And maybe you can even teach us a few tricks. So, we'll be right back. Thanks to our friends at AnimalBiome for sponsoring today's episode.  They are brilliant at applying science to improve your dog’s health.  Did you know that 60-70% of your dog’s immune cells are located in the gut microbiome?  And when their microbiome is out of balance, it can lead to inflammation associated with GI and skin issues.  My dog Winston was tested and the results were shocking!  He had way too many harmful bacteria and too few strains of the beneficial bacteria.  No wonder his immune system was always compromised!  Thanks to the AnimalBiome team for getting him back on track so that he can live a much healthier life!  Isn’t it time to test your dog’s gut health? Learn more by going to AnimalBiome.com and be sure to use the discount code WOL-20 for 20% off!

 Emerging Science and Technology Using Stem Cells in Our Dogs | File Type: audio/mpeg | Duration: 00:38:14

Hi there this is Krista with Episode #138 on the Wag Out Loud pawdcast. Because I'm going to be expanding my Wag Out Loud business with exciting things in store, I wanted to let you know that as of January 2022, I will go from releasing weekly episodes to releasing bi monthly episodes. Putting this show on is very important to me, but to do it right, and all on my own, I've decided to bring you the same awesome guests and content, but just with lesser frequency. That will give me more time to work on other fantastic projects in the canine health and wellness space. So stay tuned for some exciting future announcements. Did you know that dog owners are 15 to 36% less likely to die from a heart related event than non dog owners? Welcome to the Wag Out Loud pawdcast, where we are obsessed with bringing you helpful tips on canine health care, nutrition, and overall wellbeing. If you'd like to support the show, check out the amazing online events, products and resources that I personally recommend on the Wag Out Loud website. I'm your host, Krista and I'm super excited to be bringing you yet another tail wagging episode. Hello dog lovers, and thanks for joining us and for being an advocate for your dog's health. Today, I'm joined by Dr. Mike Hutchinson. And he is going to share the emerging science and technology using stem cells in our dogs. So this is going to be fascinating. Dr. Mike, I have been looking forward to this, it seems like forever ago that we met. We're all going to learn more about this amazing field of medicine. So can you please introduce yourself and tell us what got you interested in the science of stem cell therapy? Well, absolutely, and thanks for that kind introduction Krista. So I've been a veterinarian 35 years. I graduated from Iowa State Veterinary College in 1986. And in about 2000, I started reading about stem cells, these repair cells that are in our body. And honestly, I thought it was Sci Fi Krista. I didn't think this was something I would ever be privileged to do in my lifetime. You know, this is a kind of thing you prayed, your children would see one day. And then in 2007-2008, I got introduced to veterinary medicine, started out primarily in horses and then graduated into the dogs and cats. And since then I have been blessed with treating approximately 2000 cases, I've traveled all over the world to speak about stem cells, and to humans to veterinarians, to colleagues, lay people. And I feel like I waited 25 years of my career, just to be able to use stem cells. And once you get exposed to them, it's so exciting because we're using the regenerative ability of the body is that's what stem cells are is repair cells. Every tissue in your body contains repair cells. And we're trying to collect them, put them into a little micro environment or damaged area, like a joint or somewhere a bone or ligament and seeing if we can help start the repair process, maybe even regenerate some cartilage, but certainly reduce pain, reduce inflammation, calm down the immune system if it's overreacting, and that just improves their quality of life. So that's why I get so excited about it and love to talk about it. And you can't shut me up and say it just one of those passions of mine now. And like I said, I've been blessed to be able to do this. And I love sharing this information. I don't blame you for being so excited. This just is amazing. So is stem cell therapy pretty common in veterinary medicine? Or is it still pretty new? They you know what happens? They don't teach it in university yet. So I just gave a talk of emerging science and technology to a group in Queens College in April. And we're trying to reach the Advanced Biology students in high school. That's the next wave next generation, you know, in the veterinary schools are not teaching yet when I go out and speak at conferences, one of my sons is a veterinarian now for three years. And it's funny that, you know, he grew up with a father that was passionate about stem cells. So he knew about stem cells. And he said they weren't taught one word about them. And he graduated three years ago. And that's sad. So yeah, I’m on human boards and I’m on four boards all together. So I work with what we call autologous stem cell therapy, which means we take them out of your dog and put them back into your dog. We don't take them out of another dog and put them into your dog that would be allogeneic. And if I took them out of a pig and put them in your dog, that'd be called xenogeneic. and so I don't work with at this time, I don't work with allogeneic or xenogeneic. I only work with autologous therapy, which means I treat the patient with his own stem cells. And so what we're doing is we're harvesting fat and and generally it takes about 15 minutes to collect three tablespoons of fat from the dog. It's a very simple procedure for for veterinarians, it's within everybody's scope of surgery, easier than spays. And castration is really just to collect fat and and once we collect that fat, we wake them up and then we prepare the fraction of fat that contains the stem cells and separate those repair cells from the fat. And in that solution, we end up with like a soup, we call it the stromal vascular fraction, or the SDF, and in that soup, are the stem cells from the fat, which I said, are the repair cells. And then there's a lot of supporting characters, there's a lot of immune cells, there's a lot of growth factors, there's a lot of these, you know, cells that help form a new matrix or help to rebuild the framework so that they can lay down cartilage or reduce inflammation or do whatever is needed, in the area that we're injecting them. And that's the whole theory. And the promise of stem cell therapy, is if you have a bad knee, I mean, right now the standard of care after they do steroids, and you can just relate to humans, we don't do all of this in the animals, but after they do the steroids and the rooster collagen, and, and you know, they say, Okay, you’re bone on bone, it's time to chop off your knee. And that's as simply as I can explain it. And what I'm hoping for is that they'll start using stem cells, and around the world, there's been hundreds of 1000s of people treated with their own stem cells with adverse events being declared insignificant, because your body doesn't reject your own repair cells. So as long as you have a good technology that separates out those stem cells, and you inject them back into that micro environment that is damaged like a bad knee or back to bad knees, or bad tempered bad shoulder, or bad bone or ligaments, then we're hoping that we can initiate some repairing, I just gave a talk out at one of our big conferences in Las Vegas in September and presented 27 peer reviewed publications in veterinary medicine. And out of those 27 peer reviewed publications, 26 of them showed cartilage regeneration. So that's pretty significant. So now the information is coming out. And soon you'll see more and more doctors start to apply it, they just needed to see the science first. You know, here I am 35 years into my career. And when you get a dog, a lot of us older veterinarians, men and women, when we get these patients that we've seen our whole career, where they have this horrible arthritis, or they have a lot of pain, they're having difficulty walking, they're overweight, because it's hard to exercise them. They may be 10, 11, 12, or 14 having trouble getting up and the owners are having trouble picking them up. We've given them steroids, we've done all the nutraceuticals, chiropractic, acupuncture, all the holistic things we can do. And the poor dogs or cats are in pain, and they just can't stand without assistance. And that's why I love to come into stem cells. because up till then we had nothing else. But unfortunately, that discussion about is it time? because your dog can't get up in the morning suffering. And that's the hardest discussion for any veterinarian. So all of us in that situation, would gladly want to try to give some repair cells that could perhaps not only put time on the dog's life for the cat’s life, but quality times so they end up in a situation where his quality of life, they're in less pain they're in, you know, there have more mobility and flexibility and range of motion. So those dogs instead of trying to go to the bathroom in one place or moving around, because they can't because the pain or trying to get in and out of the car or on the furniture up and down the stairs, we treat them and generally in three to six weeks, seven weeks, they're doing those things again, and it lasts for a year, year and a half on average, which is pretty cool stuff. And, and I think anybody would want to do it. And now the price has come down back in 2007, we were treating dogs, it was about 50% More expensive than it is now. And now we're down in that range of a typical surgery. And it makes it more affordable to more people. And I wanted to, you know, get down to the hundreds of dollars instead of you know, $1,800 or $2,000. And it's a and I think the more animals that we start treating the more veterinarians that get involved, we'll get those economies of scale just like any other new technology. When it comes out. When more people start using it, the prices come down. And you said that you get these cells from the dog themselves these fat cells. Where in the body are you taking them or harvesting them from? Good question we can harvest from anywhere that there's fat and most dogs when we go on body condition score in cats too, body condition score, four to five out of nine is considered ideal body weight. So that's the dog where you can see their last two to three ribs, when they take a deep breath. Most people would call that dog skinny, but every veterinarian would say that's ideal. That’s the perfect body weight. they live longer. So I would say 55% of patients I see are at a six out of nine to seven out of nine, which means they're in each numbers about 10% of being overweight. So seven out of nine is 20% overweight if we say five is ideal. So those dogs usually have a pocket of fat behind their shoulder blade up towards the top of their back. That is a goldmine for fat so I take a lot of the fat from dogs in that area, because a lot of them are a little overweight. If they're a thin dog, I take it from their belly, we take it just in front of their belly button. towards the head, there's a what we call a falciform ligament, which is truly all fat. They're born with it. And we can take the fat right there. And we can get enough fat from that area to process and it's about a 15 minute procedure either way. That's cool. So if more veterinarians are doing this, and it's not taught in vet school, could any general practice veterinarian do this? Or is there some training involved? So it's my favorite question. So when I go to these conferences, and when I tell that they can be doing it the following week, all they need is the equipment and the technology, the technology for in house therapy. So yesterday, I did two treatments with stem cells. So I harvest the fat or I start surgeries around 7am. So I started my first one at 7am. 7:20, I gave it to my tech, and my tech starts processing that fat. It takes about two and a half hours in house. And that process is done by qualified technicians that have been put through a very simple training procedure, which is within their toolset very, very easy. It's like baking a cake, you're just following instructions. And so the first few times, and I got to go over when they were doing the first one in a state, Utah, Florida, Colorado, California, I would go in their business back in 2010-2011. I fill out there and I joined them, I would say have at least two cases, so I can show you on one how to process them show the technicians. And on the second one, they do it and literally they were doing it on the second one. So it's a very simple process. And once they learn it, they get so comfortable with it. And you know, I've had film crews come in and put this film camera on the shoulders of my technicians as they're doing this, and they could care less. That's how confident they get with this technology. And obviously we're keeping the cells sterile, we're doing it in a process that's been developed and rings out a lot of those cells that are in the fat. And then we we get them two and a half, three hours later, and we can inject them. So the treatment is an outpatient procedure. People too. you go in in the morning, like I said, the dogs are 7:00, most of them are heading home by noon or 1:00, you know, as soon as we're done. If I'm doing a second one, obviously, I'm not getting that into the surgery until maybe 7:30 or a quarter of eight. So then that one's going to go home a little bit later. Because it takes to me I can't speed up the processing, but the technicians do it. So the veterinarians, we require about 15-20 minutes for a time to collect the fat. And then when it's all processed, we give the dogs some light sedation and we inject the joints or the affected areas that we want to treat. And and that takes about five minutes and then they can go home because they can go home sedated. As long as the owners are are willing, and most of them are, we send them home usually by one o'clock. Okay, that sounds so easy, much better than surgery. Yes, and every veterinarian can learn this so easily. And literally, they just need the equipment and the equipment requires us to have a big centrifuge, and a water bath at body temperature that moves and after digesting the fat and that's how we separate the stem cells from it. And then an LED which is a laser emitting diode that has international patents on it all around the world that that we use on humans too, and when we put that fraction that soup that we get that stromal vascular fraction into the LED, it activates the stem cells. And what that means is it wakes them up because they're in the fat, they're dormant. They've been residing there, but they haven't been moving. And so we wake them up and we get them to start proliferating. And stem cells are very good at repopulating more stem cells so they can grow new stem cells, or they can differentiate into tissue like cartilage or bone or, or ligament or whatever we're trying to treat. And they can also secrete a whole bunch of things, a whole bunch of factors, they've identified over 17,000 genes that they can secrete. And those things will go into that microenvironment that damaged knee, that damaged area and start to grow new cells, they know what to do. In 2008-2009. When I first started speaking about stem cells, I knew about 12 things that they can do. So transform now to 2021. I know about 48 things they can do. So you say wow, that's pretty good. We we grew 400% in 10 years, 12 years. The problem is or the good thing is, is that when you're injecting those stem cells into that damaged environment, just on the side of what I'm injecting in, there's probably five to the 200th power of the available things that those stem cells can do. So super computers can't figure it out. And then you have the damaged cells on the inside the inflammation. They're what we call communicators, they're sending out distresser signals, and you know, hey, body, we need some help. We need some repair, we need some reduced inflammation we need to calm down or modulate the immune system. And they're interacting we call that the paracrine effect. It's like the endocrine system where we secrete a hormone like a thyroid hormone that helps regulate our metabolic rate with these cells communicate with each Other in this local environment, and that's what sets up the repair or the reduced inflammation, or whatever's best for that joint. And it's pretty neat. Because when you look at the age of a dog or cat, and I treated camels, horses, you know, I've been over zoo animals, they, you know, every animal that has that has repair cells. And like I said, you can, they've shown this, they publish these results in humans, they get a heart attack, we were always taught, once you have a heart attack, you have scar tissue for life, you're never going to reduce that scar tissue. So your heart will never be as efficient as it once once. Well, that's been proven incorrect. We can inject stem cells into that heart muscle. Now I'm not doing this in dogs, but it's been done in people and then animals and published and they can regenerate that scar tissue into normal, functional, beating heart cells again, and it just blows everybody away, including me. That's why I get so excited talking about this. Because, you know, these are the kinds of things we are taught that you can't once you tear your meniscus, you can't grow a new meniscus, it's gone. And people are shaking their heads. They're listening right now. Yeah, I had part of my meniscus removed. And that's just for the cushions in the knee joint. You know, they're on both sides C shaped cartilage. Once you damage and we were taught I was taught you can't regenerate. Well, guess what they've done clinical trials on animals. And now they're doing it on humans. And I'm privy to some of this information where they can 3d print a scaffold, which is kind of the framework for this cushion in our joints, this meniscus, they can feed stem cells into it and grow a new meniscus. And with with repair, so yeah, and this is, this is what is happening. That. is so cool. Can I just stop you right there? I know this is exciting, but we just have to take a quick commercial break, but we're gonna dive right in. So hold on everybody. A big thank you to the team at Adored Beast for sponsoring today’s episode. I am a HUGE fan of Adored Beast because they offer a one-of-a-kind line of high-quality, Human-grade, natural products that don’t just treat the symptoms of your dog’s ailments, but also the root causes. With an impressive line of natural, holistic treatments, these homeopathic products address core issues, support healing and aid in preventing reoccurrence. 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 Does YOUR Mood Affect Your Dog's Health? | File Type: audio/mpeg | Duration: 00:30:46

Hello this is Krista with episode #137 on the Wag Out Loud podcast. Do you feed your dog goat milk? Well, I think it's an amazing superfood. Your dog's body can digest goat milk in about 20 minutes, because the fat molecules are about 1/5 the size of those and cow's milk, which makes it easily digestible. And it's why even dogs with digestive issues may tolerate it, give it a try. Welcome to the Wag Out Loud pawdcast, where we are obsessed with bringing you helpful tips on canine health care, nutrition, and overall wellbeing. If you'd like to support the show, check out the amazing online events, products and resources that I personally recommend on the Wag Out Loud website. I'm your host, Krista and I'm super excited to be bringing you yet another tail wagging episode. Dr. Melissa Walker is an integrative holistic veterinarian in Seattle who has worked in the animal care field for 28 years.  She is passionate about the mind-body connection and how our energy affects our pet's health.  She practices acupuncture, herbal medicine, and Chinese food therapy, among other modalities.  She also is a certified yoga teacher, meditates regularly, and has a deep spiritual practice.  She celebrates the human animal bond and strives to empower you to have healthier relationships with your pets. Hi there dog lovers, and welcome to another learning opportunity here on the Wag Out Loud pawdcast. Today Dr. Melissa Walker is going to talk to us about does your mood affect your dog's health? So Dr. Melissa, thank you so much for being here. I would love it if you could introduce yourself and tell us why are you so passionate about the mind body connection, and how our energy affects our dog's health. Thank you so much, Krista. I'm so excited to be here and talk about this topic, because I am extremely passionate about it. I actually started back in 1993, working in the veterinary field. And so I have had a lot of experience witnessing interactions between pets and their people. And what I noticed is that our moods and our health and the way that we are really does affect our pets. And I'm excited to kind of share some of my insights around that and offer some potential things that may be helpful to increase, you know, the relationship that we have with our pets, because what I witness is that our health can actually affect their health, too. Absolutely, yeah. Well, before we dive into this, I know that dogs are sentient animals, meaning that they can experience both positive and negative emotions like pleasure, comfort, fear, things like anxiety, and a poor mental state, where a dog is regularly experiencing negative emotions from us, you know, if we're stressed out, that has been proven to show poor health on their part, and I think a study published on or actually in the publication Animal Cognition, that dogs can actually smell emotional states. So why don't we start with energy, because we're all made of energy. And I know that you have a lot to share about that. Absolutely, we are all made of energy, the earth’s made of energy, our pets are made of energy. And we're made of energy. And we actually radiate as well as our pets, an electromagnetic field. And the largest field that we radiate is actually generated from our hearts. And you might think it comes from our head, because we spend a lot of time there. But really, the greatest field, it's 100 times more strong coming from our heart, from an electrical standpoint, what we're putting out in the world, versus what our brain is putting out in the world. And then also we can actually attract things from this magnetic point of view 1000 times stronger back into our hearts. And so we have a negative and a positive terminal, just like a magnet on the head we’re positive and you know, kind of in our groin, we're negative and we actually circulate energy, and that energy can be shifted based on our emotional states, our physical states and our mental states so our pets can actually feel that energy, we can actually feel that energy from our pets. And we also emit things like chemicals like what we were just mentioning, and we actually there are actual chemicals that we emit when we are stressed and in fear. And dogs as you know, they can smell everything. And they can actually sense that and they can also witness our body posture and our facial expressions. And so there's really no hiding our emotional state from our pet. They can, they can feel it, they can smell it, they can see it, and that's okay. But it's just something to be aware of, especially if we are in prolonged negative emotional states because that can be a drain over time, that's one of the things to be aware of. Okay. So we all know when we get sad, our dogs can sense it, and they, you know, they put their head in their in our laps, or they just want to be calm and be with us. Right? I was going somewhere with this, oh, if somebody is depressed, like constantly in a state of depression, that dog is inevitably going to become depressed as well, correct? Yeah, I mean, usually, there are some really resilient pets that just have a happy go lucky attitude, you know, regardless, but a lot, a lot of the time, and I see this more depression, yes, but more with anxiety that, you know, it's very hard. If you're constantly even if you think about our human to human interactions, you are constantly around someone who is very anxious or depressed, you know, it does definitely affect you. And you can even walk into a room and feel that so like, the animals definitely do pick up on that. And for depending on their personality, in Chinese medicine, we look at the different five elements, and there's different types of personality, we've got fire types, which are usually kind of joyful and exuberant, but on the the unbalanced end of that they can know kind of exhibit anxiety, that wood types that are usually kind of motivated and like to do things by, you know, they can kind of tend toward frustration, and then there's like the spleen types, which is like for digestion, they actually, you know, they can be very empathetic, like you were talking about putting their head in your lap and being kind to you, but they also kind of really take on worry. And that can that can actually affect their digestion. And so that's one of the cool things that I love about Chinese medicine, is that we don't delineate just physical symptoms. And so this is just a digestive problem, kind of look at the emotional aspects as well. Is there worry in the household is this, you know, is the dog worrying? Are you worrying? or things like that, and in shifting those sorts of emotional states can actually have a positive effect on our health. You bring up a good point, especially during COVID, when, you know, we were spending so much more time with our dogs, that if they are our teacher, our family, our therapist, you know, if we are seeking stress relief from them, are we giving them the outlets that they need? Which, what would those be? Yeah, and there's balance, right? In every relationship, there's balance. So there's, you know, that's one of the beautiful things about having a pet, it's like, You're okay, you know, you're allowed to have a bad day. And, you know, as human beings, we have, you know, challenging times in our life, it's more about how long does that prolong right? Is it? Is it a bad mood? Or is this going, you know, kind of coming back into your temperament person, no personality, and yeah, it can be, it can be a big strain. One of one of the interesting things that I, I noticed, because I do house calls in Seattle, and one of the interesting things that I noticed during COVID times is that I always had muzzles, but I usually kept them in my car. But during times of high stress, around election time around things, when there were big news events and things like that, I actually felt like I needed to keep my muzzles in my bag, because I was noticing there was actually a little more aggression being exhibited in some of my patients that wouldn't normally exhibit aggression. And so, I just found that an interesting kind of observation during the challenging times of COVID. And, yeah, so that's one of the things that I recognized. And then, you know, over time is this, you know, has been as collective, you know, lately so there's been a lot of stress, kind of, you know, kind of worrying about the future and, you know, wondering what's going on, and the animals definitely are picking up on that I'm noticing more anxiety and, you know, kind of drains to their drains to their health. So there are ways to kind of approach that though. So that's the exciting thing. It's not all doom and gloom. So we should spend more time with our dogs, let them be dogs, let them play on walks, let them sniff you know, make it their walk. Try not to speak on your phone while you're walking your dog because it's a great bonding time for both of you. Anything else that you can think of that we really need to focus on with our dogs’ stress release. Absolutely, I mean, that's one of the joys of having a dog right, they show us how to have fun and to not take life so seriously, right. So that's actually like one of the biggest key things I think of having having dogs, right. And so like, if we can look to them to kind of guide us in that way, but exercise is awesome doing it together with your pet, even better, they're touching the, you know, the ground with their feet. So they're automatically grounding, which is actually helping their energetic field, if you can do the same, and take your shoes off and get in the sand and sit under a tree that will definitely help your energetic field as well. laughing, doing, I think you mentioned some of these things, yoga, eating well, and making sure you're taking care of yourself, they love you, they want you to, you know, they want you to be feeling good. And one of the most powerful things that we can do, actually to, that we can do to really kind of take care of our emotional state is one, a gratitude practice, just kind of coming back into ourselves and our heart and looking around and really just taking note of what is good, and what we have to be thankful for. And that may be them, you know, like, you know them just being in our life and expressing that to them, because they will feel that love, they will feel that gratitude and data, the you know, even the smartest dog can't really read your mind, but they can feel your intention and your love. And that is really, really grateful. And being grateful that anything, they can feel that. And then the other thing is just like really, you know, taking good deep belly breaths. Like if you're noticing that your mind is spinning and out of you know, out of control. You're looping thoughts and things like that just one of the best ways to kind of get back in your body is to take nice, deep belly breaths, and actually take a longer exhale than your inhale. I actually have some clients and pets that like they meditate and the pets actually look, you know, the dogs and I've definitely heard this story with a bunny as well. They look forward to it. I have a friend. And I love the bunny because the bunny will actually like stamp their little feet like pop, you know. I mean, like it's time to meditate now. And so our pets actually try to you know, they're they're our teachers. They're like, hey, let's have fun. Let's walk away from the work. You know, a lot of us are sitting at the desk all day. And you know, great way to kind of move your energy and it's to go out for a little walk or a little bit of play time. And being really actively present during that time can make a huge difference in the quality and the impact. Wow, great tips. And yes, Winston and I do meditate together every morning. And that's how we start our day. And I highly recommend that we use the calm app in case anybody is wondering. best thing ever! guided meditations or just music or nature sounds. It's really powerful. Well, Dr. Melissa, we are at a time where we need to take a quick commercial break so we will be right back. 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Welcome back everyone! we are with Dr. Melissa Walker. And we are learning about how our energy and emotions affect the health of our dogs. And it's just fascinating. So Dr. Melissa, I know that there was a Swedish study back in 2019. I remember reading about this, where they did a study of hair cortisol of dogs. Can you tell us a little bit about the outcome? Yeah, that was a really interesting study, they researched 58 people with their dogs. I think it was primarily Border Collies and Shetland Sheep dogs. And what they did is they measured the cortisol, which is essentially stress hormone, and they measured that in the hair. So over, you know, it kind of shows stress over a period of time, not just an isolated event. And one of the really interesting and fascinating outcomes of the study was that they recognized that the owner’s personality, the people's personality actually had a lot more of an effect on the dog's cortisol levels than vice versa. Meaning that even if the pets were, you know, neurotic, or stressed, it really didn't affect their people too much. But if the people were stressed, and I think they use the words in the, in the thing, neuroticism, which I looked up to mean mental, emotional, and physical reactions that are drastic and irrational conscientiousness and openness, it really did have a significant statistically impact on the the cortisol concentration. And this is describing, you know, just suggested that the, you know, the pets really do mirror, our emotional state. And interestingly, when I think about this, as a doctor, you know, I look at what cortisol does in the system. And cortisol is great, if you have a, you know, have a life or death situation, you really need to like, move fast and mobilize your energy to you know, get out of harm's way, but prolonged stress, over time can actually, you know, suppress our immune system. And so, you know, we have things that, you know, we want to have a strong immune system. Over time, actually, cortisol can weaken our connective tissues, and so we've got dogs that are outside playing, and it might be a little bit more likely for them to sprain or strain, you know, a ligament or tendon with prolonged stress, just because the tissues themselves can get weaker, prolonged cortisol, actually, we have to make it in our body. And so it actually picks some of the building blocks that we might use to make hormones so it can actually affect our hormonal balance and their hormonal balance. And, you know, with that can, you know, change the behavior and with immune suppression, we can see an increase in cancer risk and, and actually increasing inflammation, which is, you know, a large problem in our pets, so, so cortisol really does, you know, in the long term have an impact on overall health in so many ways. And so, so I found that study interesting, and just really kind of thinking about what the ramifications of an increased cortisol level could be. Yeah, that makes sense. Interesting. Well, I know, during the break, you were telling me that you have a story about a dog that was seizing, do you want to share that? Sure, yeah, I have a had a patient who, you know, Great Pyrenees dog. And so they are programed to be hyper vigilant, they are great guard dogs and really, really sweet dog and this dog had a history of seizures. And you know, we were you know, doing a lot of different things like acupuncture, herbal medicine and traditional kind of therapies and things and this dog’s owners were great, they were you know, they were really, you know, they're present for the dog, they were doing everything that I asked them to, and so there's generally genuinely no kind of no judgment or blame around this, but there was a very distinct kind of observation that when when times were really stressful that this dog would actually would be fine, and then actually have seizures. And so it was it was pretty remarkable to like, be able to witness that like when when we're really stressed, you know, this dog would actually have seizures that were a little bit, you know, were more difficult to control and that when times were a little bit easier, this the the seizure activity went down. And so that's the kind of, you know, fascinating to me, that we can you know, that our emotions can have that much impact. And, obviously, there's no way to prove the cause and effect, but it was definitely an observation that we all witnessed and so for just, you know, kind of knowing that this is another kind of encouragement to take care of ourselves and to manage stress. Yes, absolutely. Wow, that's fascinating. Well, you mentioned before we talked about what cortisol does to the body and you said that it could change behavior. So if over time dogs experience stress and anxiety could they become aggressive or possibly fearful you know, are those the changes of behavior you're thinking about? Yeah, I think that is I do think that that is a is a possibility and I think that's part of what I was witnessing during you know, this this whole COVID lockdown actually, because this is one of the things that as humans we the way that our brain works like we can look back into the past and you know kind of you know, be depressed but we can also be worried in the future whereas dogs don't really kind of worry about their you don't really worry about their job or their finances or politics or anything like that and so when we're generating these thoughts in our brain it actually produces these chemicals that like we're fearful right and normally fear in you know in the wild is a short lived thing like I said you know we get out of yeah fight or flight there's a tiger and you know there's a tiger we have to run, we got to hide, you know fight and if that's prolonged right, you know when you think about that okay, we’ve got to run right okay. Oh we're stressed and you know that can you know manifest in that way where there's you know, there's pacing there's you know, avoidance there's there's things like that Oh, we’ve got to fight like I'm gonna like you know, kind of I call it you know, like I'm gonna beat you up before you you know, you get to me and so there's this hyper vigilance that can happen where there's just like kind of reactivity and then there's there's freeze there are you know, there are pets that can kind of just be like whoa, this is too much I don't know how to like my nervous system can't handle this I'm just gonna kind of like kind of like you know, isolate and kind of hide this so there's different ways we all have our own you know, personalities and stresses and how they react to it, but absolutely a constant state of fear or stress, you know, can result in aggression, just you know, because we don't feel secure. That makes sense. And I know since you practice Chinese medicine that these negative emotions directly affect organs, our organs and our dog's organs. Can you briefly touch on that? Sure, I think I think I mentioned a few earlier but with worry. So our spleen and our stomach that in Chinese medicine, the spleen really kind of relates to digestion and so with with worry, that can really affect digestion and one of the ways that I see that expressing itself is you know, I have a lot of patients that come to me because they have either chronic health issues, you know, cancer, things that other people can't figure out. And you know, it's been a long road and one of the things that I see sometimes is you know, making recommendations like feed this or take this and you know, in rightly so we should be you know, you know, making sure that we're doing the right thing but like if there is worry like if you're if you're like oh I don't know if this food is going to be good or Oh like I'm not sure if this is going to work and you put that food in the bowl for your pet while you're worried is like it's going to upset their tummy, they're going to pick up on that worry and be like Oh, I should be worried right? And we can't actually digest properly even if it's the best nutritious foods possible if we're in a state of worry. And so you know, one of the things that you know when you are putting down the food having that intention You know, this is for your you know, this is for your enjoyment This is for your nourishment and this is you know for your highest good and and even just that intention in itself and just like letting yourself off the hook because you are genuinely when you're feeding your pet, you're you are genuinely doing the best you can with, you know, with the resources you have with the knowledge you have and just like accepting that as truth, it's like I'm doing the best I can I'm doing the best for my pet. And you know, I anticipate that this is going to be good, it can actually change how they digest. And then yeah, I know, I know and know and you know, the lungs actually hold grief and sadness and so you know, when you're sad and taking that deep breath and elimination and so, you know, if we've got a prolonged kind of sadness and grief for that and I do see that sometimes especially with you know, losing Losing a pet or, you know, losing, you know, you know, when people go back to work, you know, losing their people, you know. Exactly you know, and you know, that's actually the lungs and the colon in Chinese medicine and so you know, we can have elimination kind of stressed colitis and things like that, that can kind of manifest and so kind of taking the day, like, if we're having a good day to day and this is, you know, just changing attitude and mindset can actually have an impact. Fear affects the urinary system, kidneys. And anxiety really affects the heart, cardiovascular system and the hormonal system. And anger, anger and frustration is really interesting, definitely see this quite prevalently in our animal population, but also in our human population. And, and really, the liver does a lot of really amazing things in the body. You know, from a kind of Western perspective, it's our major detoxing organ, it stores blood, makes clotting factors, it does a lot of really, I mean, it has, like, I don't even know, like 60 functions at least. And so it's really, you know, a busy, busy organ. in the Chinese paradigm. We look at it as coursing the chi, well, what does that mean? That means that it circulates the energy in the body. And when energy gets stuck in the body, we can have discomfort, we can have pain, you can have immobility and also detoxing emotions and things like that and so when we do have like prolonged periods of frustration and stress. I think they and anger, you know, they may be mirroring that back for us sometimes. Right? But it really can affect on a systemic level, our ability to circulate our circulate our energy, which can actually result in pain and issues with detoxification and, and our energy. So the liver in Chinese medicine, the liver can what we call overact on the spleen, so it can get so upset that we you know, negatively affect our digestion. And really, this does happen with pets as well. I always say we, but I always think we're all together. Oh my gosh, well, this has just been mind blowing. And I'm sure there's so much more to it. But hopefully we've given people something to think about. Please do your further research. You know, your dog is intuitive and sensitive to your moods and reactions. So as Dr. Melissa said, self care, very important. If we show up in a good way in a good mood with great thoughts and intentions, our dogs are going to pick up on that energy. So Dr. Melissa, this has been amazing. Where can everyone find out more information about you and your practice? Yes, thank you, Krista. And I love that you're meditating in the morning, which is awesome. I love it. Yes, you can find more about me my my practice website is www.vvcseattle.com or www.drmelissawalker.com . And I have a little pop up there for my newsletter. And please let me know any questions that you have any topics that you're interested in, I would love to hear any feedback and, and really, I'm interested as well as like, you know, do you share any symptoms with your pets? Or do you notice any changes when you're stressed? Like I'm really looking to be able to support all of you as pet owners, the best ways that I can so any feedback is welcome and encouraged that that's the best place to find me right now. Instagram @drmelissawalker      Facebook  https://www.facebook.com/VitalityVetCare      Linkedin https://www.linkedin.com/in/melissa-walker-b1b5571a/ All right, fantastic. Well, Dr. Melissa, we're gonna have to have you on again, because you have so much to share, and we really appreciate it. So thank you for being with us today. Thank you so much, and I would love that. Thanks again to the team at The Original Mine Pet Platter for sponsoring this episode.  Check out the ultimate mealware for all dog foods by going to https://minepetplatter.com/and be sure to use the code WOL10 for 10% off! Thanks for listening. You'll find some helpful links in the show notes and if you enjoy the show, please be sure to follow and listen for free on your favorite podcast app. And please, please share your feedback. Visit WagOutLoud.com for great product recommendations with discounts, amazing online events and fantastic resources. That's also where to visit our Bark About It page where you can suggest topics, guests or products. Be advised that this show offers health and nutritional information and is designed for educational purposes only. You're encouraged to do your own research and should not rely on this information as a substitute for nor does it replace professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. If you have any concerns or questions about your dog's health, you should always consult a veterinarian or a nutrition expert. Have a tail wagging day and we'll catch you next time. Hey Winston was that another tail wagging episode?

 Innovations For the Love of Dogs | File Type: audio/mpeg | Duration: 00:31:32

Hello this is Krista with episode #136 on the Wag Out Loud pawdcast. I'm just checking in. Have you checked out all of the amazing partner products that I highly recommend? I have vetted these companies and products, have used them on my own dog Winston, and I can assure you that they will help your dog to thrive. Just go to WagOutLoud.com and check out the partner Products section. And I've negotiated discounts for most of them, so why not see what can make a difference in your dog's life? Did you know that the liver performs about 1500 essential functions in your dog's body? That's one busy organ! Welcome to the Wag Out Loud pawdcast, where we are obsessed with bringing you helpful tips on canine health care, nutrition, and overall wellbeing. If you'd like to support the show, check out the amazing online events, products and resources that I personally recommend on the Wag Out Loud website. I'm your host, Krista and I'm super excited to be bringing you yet another tail wagging episode. Faz Bashi is Scientist, Physician, Investor and Entrepreneur focused on human and animal health and life sciences. He is a Champion for Entrepreneurs, Innovators, and Possibletarians who want to make the world a better place. Hi there dog lovers! Thanks for joining us today and wanting to learn more about innovations for the love of dogs. And to chat with us about this topic is Faz Bashi. He is a scientist, a physician, investor, and entrepreneur. Faz, thank you so much for being with us. Can you introduce yourself and share why are you so passionate about focusing on innovations in healthcare and life sciences, specifically for dogs? Wow, Krista. So thank you for that beautiful intro. And by the way, congratulations, Wag Out Loud is really busting a seam . So I'm excited. I'm so excited to be here. And yeah, my background is in healthcare and the sciences. And I've spent a lot of time just recently, probably over the past, I'd say about 12-13 years, focused on innovation, entrepreneurship, angel investing, venture capital, doing a lot of those things. And animal health is a big passion area for me, and I know you and I share a love for all animals, and specifically with dogs. Dogs are just an amazing creature. They are just incredible additions to our lives. They're just we're so blessed to have them. And they're definitely becoming more and more integrated into our families. In fact, people refer to them as their fur babies. Yeah, and they truly are. And we want what's best for them as we want for ourselves. We want convenience of being able to, to be able to take care of whatever may be ailing them or concerning them be able to do it at home. So I'm excited about the future of pet health and veterinary medicine, all these things and I want to be able to contribute to it. And that's why I'm here because you are too. You and I chatting I mean, we just said before this started how are we going to fit all of this into such a short interview? So I guess where I would like to start is since your background is in immunology and virology, are those the areas of medicine that most interest you? It's an area where I have expertise. But I am looking at the whole picture of humans and animals. So the whole picture what what concerns me is everything from snout to tail, right so everything in between there that affects a dog's well being, their health, their coat, everything. the food that goes in. you and I've talked about this a lot. intake and output right? So inputs and outputs, what food goes in and what comes out. Everything in between really matters a lot to the health and well being of the animals. So there's so many opportunities there to do good things. Well, Faz you are a busy busy guy. Did I read that you recently became a member of the Board of Trustees at the Morris Animal Foundation? Is that correct? That is correct. Oh What an absolute honor and just an amazing group of people. Morris Animal Foundation for those who don't know is a 75 year old brand, nonprofit entity created by Dr. Morris. By the way, an original entrepreneur in his day. So if you know about KD Diet for kidney disease, Dr. Morris is credited for having created that, that brand, and so from pennies off of every can that was sold that went into the coffers. Morris Animal Foundation now is one of the oldest and one of the largest grant givers to scientists studying animal health and wellness across the country, across the world even and they're doing great things. So I'm just delighted and just absolutely honored to be in this group of amazing people. And guess what? They’re based in Colorado! That is what a perfect fit. That's, that's really cool. So do you know of any exciting things that they're working on as far as scientific innovations or studies that are going to be coming out? It's happening all the time. And so if you look at all the veterinary institutions across the country, whether they're schools or just institutions of science, if a researcher is getting a grant from the NIH, they're also probably getting a grant from the Morris Animal Foundation. That's how amazing this organization is. So there is so much going on across the country in basic science research from gastrointestinal issues that are going on various kinds of infectious diseases as well. And by the way, you know, we're living in the world of COVID right so we all know now this word known as the Coronavirus. Well Coronavirus, also has a variant of its own, that's species specific, that affects dogs and cats on their own. And now we're learning also more and more about how diseases jump from animals to humans, and sometimes from humans to animals as well. But there's a lot going on that we need to all be aware of. And also how does it then eventually, how does that knowledge then eventually become a product or something that you and I will use for our fur babies? That's the important thing. And I think Morris is playing an absolute critical role and doing all those things. How, exciting. Well, the industry as a whole, do you think that animal health is pretty much following in the footsteps of human health? Or are there instances where it's the other way around? How far behind is veterinary medicine to human medicine? Well, you know, there's a lot of corollaries obviously, between humans and animals. And, and as you also know, there's a lot of initial testing that is done on animals, when a drug comes out to market or a medical device comes out to market, there's a lot of stuff that goes on there. And what's really important to consider, at least as far as the industry is concerned, is there's this deep desire from anyone who goes into veterinary medicine or human medicine, to do good to do no harm to be there for the individual patient that comes in. Now for veterinary medicine is a little bit different, right? Because the actual patient cannot speak. It's really the pet parent that is speaking on behalf of the dog or the cat or the hamster when they come in. So there's something extraordinary if you think about it, that happens between a veterinarian and the pet parent on behalf of the animal. There's this three way connection that's happening in the room around that patient. So there's something extraordinary about one, the relationship that's happening there, the information that needs to be gathered, there's a lot of diagnostics that are available. But at the end of the day, the story that we give to our let's say, our primary care physician, when we go into for our physical exam, the story is what's really important. When did it happen? What does the pain or issue look like? And that has to come from the pet parent. So there's a great deal of reliance on information gathering from the pet parent. And then there's what do you do with all the data that is being generated? Now with COVID? Krista, this is kind of exciting because both human and animal medicine has had to go through a major transformation because of the world we live in. It's not convenient anymore to just take a ride down to the veterinary clinic or the human clinic and see someone in person. So there's a lot of transformations that are happening right now, on the digital side of care. How do you present a patient to a veterinarian through telemedicine, let's say, and there's a lot of that that's going on? Or how do you change your workflow, so that you no longer have to have people sitting in a waiting room, but you might be able to see them on the curb side, and then be able to take the patient in to be able to get the treatment they need. So yeah, there is a lot of corollaries and I would say both the human and the animal health side of things really are focusing on major transformations over the next five to 10 years. Hmm, okay, get ready. Faz, you are one of the founders of Anubis Bio, and I love the company. I met you quite a while ago, and you have a product called DoggyStat, and I love, love, love that product. Can you tell us how did that company and the product come to be? Yeah, you know, so I think we talked about this just a little earlier. You know, pet parents nowadays are really treating their dogs and their cats and their pets as members of the family. And as we looked at the marketplace and tried to find solutions there, we wanted to find ways of naturally resolving issues that the animals were dealing with. And so the idea of using food, food, and what's inside of DoggyStat is our patented food supplement. It's made from eggs and milk, very simple ingredients. And what it does is it helps to solve stomach upset, normal stomach upset that animals get whether it's from stress, a new environment, loud noises, going into doggy daycare, or boarding facility for an extended period of time. Anything that stresses out the animal, the dog, eventually what happens is it manifests in their GI tract. they get stomach upset, and then they get diarrhea. The other issue is there's lots of other factors that dogs may pick up on a daily walk or going to a dog park and visiting with other dogs or other things that may contribute to their stomach upset. So the genesis of the company and the intellectual property was around this idea of how do we deliver a natural product that helps essentially resolve these types of gastrointestinal stomach upset from stress or from other factors in a meaningful manner. And we've done it through DoggyStat, and I appreciate the fact that you also agree it's it really is doing some wondrous things for for pet parents will get so much great feedback. And we're in distribution now. Through MWI Animal Health, they are distributing to over 90% of the veterinary practices across the country. So really great partnership, and we're just delighted to be here. Fantastic! Well, thank you for bringing that to market. Oh my gosh, what a great product. Okay, well, we're here to talk about innovations. So what do you think that we'll be seeing in the future when it comes to advancements or new technology specifically geared towards canine health and wellness? Krista there's so much happening right now, as we just touched on a little bit earlier COVID, the world of COVID and the world of working at home and convenience of being at home, there's a lot of shifting now away from going to a hospital or going to a clinic and coming to home. So we already touched on telemedicine, telemedicine is definitely that. It is happening. And there's a lot of different platforms that you've heard of out there, from Ask a Vet to Dutch, to a whole bunch of other platforms where you can get care at home, or you can even ask for a veterinarian to come to your door. So those are those are very cool things. So here's the here's the thing that everyone has to contend with. At some point, the veterinarian needs highly accurate information from from the pet and from the parents. And so how do you get that data to them? Well, the world of wearables is advancing like crazy. And you and I just talked a little earlier about this, but I'm actually working with an amazing company that is developing the most accurate wearable, that gives you medical grade information through a collar, through a vet. Being able to look at biometric data in a you know, very sensitive way is just so valuable. So that's one of the areas I think wearables you're going to see more and more of these types of medical grade technologies coming through. There's a lot going on in terms of diagnostics, especially for areas that are the most common reasons for parents to take their pets into into the veterinarian's office. And, you know, periodontal disease. I've heard quite a bit from my friends who are in the world of dentistry for animals, and they're looking for innovations. And I think there's some really cool things that are happening right now as we speak, on being able to, to help detect periodontal disease ahead of time in cats or dogs or any other species, and then also being able to transform that information into into real preventative measures that you can take so that you can actually see results. See what's happening when you actually brush the teeth of your dog or your cat. So there's there's a number of things Krista that are really exciting and food. I mean, we could go on and on about how amazing new companies are. Coming up with incredible new sources of proteins for dogs and cats and just incredible stuff going on. Well Faz, I am going to stop you there for just a moment we are going to take a quick commercial break and then get back into innovations. We'll be right back. SPONSOR AD Now here’s a product that every dog owner needs to have on hand.  Thanks to our friends at DoggyStat for sponsoring this episode.  DoggyStat is THE rapid, all natural canine anti-diarrheal that works!  It’s an easy to use food supplement that helps your dog rapidly return to normal intestinal function and typically resolves loose stools within 12-24 hours.  I highly recommend that every dog owner have DoggyStat on hand because let’s face it, there will be times when your dog’s gut needs a little help.  It’s easy, all natural made with quality human-grade ingredients, works quickly, is for dogs of all ages and sizes dogs love the taste.  Check out DoggyStat.com and be sure to use the discount code WOL for 10% off of your first order! 

 Velcro Dogs! How to Address Separation Anxiety | File Type: audio/mpeg | Duration: 00:36:13

Hi there this is Krista with episode #135 on the Wag Out Loud pawdcast. have you checked out all of the amazing partner products that I highly recommend? These are products that I have tried and can recommend that will help your dog to thrive. Just go to wagoutloud.com and check out the Partner Products section, and I've negotiated discounts for most of them, so why not see what can make a difference in your dog's life? Many veterinarians believe that 80% of all chronic diseases in pets can be traced back to poor digestion and an unhealthy gut. So what are you doing to improve your dog's gut health? Welcome to the Wag Out Loud pawdcast, where we are obsessed with bringing you helpful tips on canine health care, nutrition, and overall wellbeing. If you'd like to support the show, check out the amazing online events, products and resources that I personally recommend on the Wag Out Loud website. I'm your host, Krista and I'm super excited to be bringing you yet another tail wagging episode. Master Dog Trainer, Toriano Sanzone, has been training Professionally for 21 years. Toriano Sanzone founded DOPA DOGS in 2001 which became Sanzone School of Dog Training which finally became Wolfkeeper University. Wolfkeeper University has trained thousands of Dogs all around the world and has worked with some of the Greatest Dog Trainers in the World.  Hello dog lovers and welcome to another informative episode of The Wag Out Loud pawdcast. Let's all learn something new from today's guest, Toriano Sanzone, and he is going to be chatting about velcro dogs, and how to address separation anxiety. Toriano thanks so much for being with us today. Thank you. How are you, Krista? I am good. And I'm excited to have you teach us more about separation anxiety. So why don't you introduce yourself because you are an expert and tell us why you're so passionate about training dogs and about dog behavior in general. I am super passionate about training dogs, primarily because I've been training dogs and exposed to dogs since I was four years old. That's important because why are you so intuitive, like I was pushed into it. my mom raised Afghan hounds back in 1978 in Illinois, we had four of them. That's a very challenging dog acting down dog, what I grew up with. So always from ‘78 till when I professionally started training dogs in 2000. Just seeing how you can transform a person's life. I see that the dog manifestation that's going on in the person's world and just just the magic the dog brings as human beings and I've seen so many case stories and miracles I could talk about forever and why I love helping people train their dogs to be great canine good citizens. And you are the wolf keeper. I am the wolf keeper! I love it. Well, I think this is so timely because obviously we've been living through this pandemic and things are kind of getting back to normal but that means that instead of spending 24/7 with our dogs that we've been doing over the past year, we are leaving them alone again for longer periods of time and many dogs are freaking out with separation anxiety. So I think this statistic is probably old but I heard that 13% to 18% of dogs show signs of separation anxiety and it's diagnosed in 20% to 40% of dogs that are referred to behavioral specialists like yourself. Is that still the case? Or do you think there's more dogs suffering from this? Wow that's that's interesting source. Yeah, I would say that is higher. you know that those percentages just primarily because one due to the pandemic, I know the dog industry went up by 300%. So now is this pandemic puppy and it's not that hard to create separation anxiety in the dog. I would be as bold to say that close to 50% to 60% of dogs in America have some form of separation anxiety. Okay, so you're working with this with clients every single day? I mean because primarily separation anxiety is really easy for that to happen to the animal. I mean so for example, just take the dog I'm dealing with right now. you know a person gets beautiful little Chow Chow puppy, who are some of the cutest little puppies in the world. is just a little ball of fur. Literally little bitty legs, stubby legs. And what was the first thing you want to do Krista? Is You want to pick it up and carry it. How can you not… Yeah, you want to cuddle that little thing. It’s like a little bear. but the thing that ends up happening is that, then the dog has pitocin levels, and all the different just chemicals that make a baby duck follow mama duck or why children, the little baby that reaches up. Pick me up, pick me up. It's so easy to create that into a dog as a puppy versus don't pick up the puppy is like who can't pick up a puppy. That's so mean cruel. Exactly. Like I really pick them up don't pick them up all the time. That's impossible. So what ends up happening is that it’s kind of like the entryway to separation anxiety. I was at a party on Tuesday were my close friend of mine, close to 20 years. His wife said I have someone that's going to dog sit and that’s going to sleep in the bed with my two pitbulls when I’m not here. and she is she meant that 100%. 100,000% she meant that. So what ends up happening is that when does a dog get kicked out to bed? so if you're a single person, the dog might get kicked out because now you're engaged with another dog owner. the dogs starts saying know what? If I'm kicked out the bed I'm gonna cry. You know whine. Some dogs they're not going to cry or whine kick me out the bed. I'm gonna go pee on the carpet. Some dogs say I'm gonna pee on your pillow. some dogs say. I'm gonna pee and bark. Some dogs are gonna pee, bark, and poop. Yeah. And vomit. You know, I'm gonna pee, bark, poop, vomit, and I'm going to bite whatever I perceive to be kicking me out of the bed. You know. So there’s different levels to the separation anxiety and it really doesn't take much for the dog to get there. Yeah. So are you saying essence that much of this behavior is because we have allowed this to happen? this codependent relationship to form in the first place? Absolutely. One of my mentors, who I super love, Cesar Millan told me directly to my face one time he said, people they love their dogs and they don't understand dog psychology. You know so, dog psychology says that a dog needs its own den. So that cute little, little gorgeous… I do not have a dog specifically in my head cuz I'm training to Chow Chow puppy right now. Even for me, it's so hard to resist wanting to pick this puppy up and put him inside the crate, put them inside of his kennel, but he has to live inside of his kennel because then the dog says hey, you know what? When you go to work, I'm going to go inside my condo. Meaning when you have company over I'm going to go inside of my condo. You know when we travel in the car, I'm going to travel, not just in the car when we're traveling inside the condo which is inside with the car because thing I tell people the only thing that will be consistent in your dog's life. No matter where you travel, no matter who you bring into the household. No matter how many animals you bring into the household, will be their dog crate. Most dogs aren't crated. people have tons of aversions to crating their dogs. I've heard literally every possible reason why not to crate the dog. It just doesn't take much for the dog to be dependent upon codependent upon following you around the house or wanting to be picked up or sitting in the chair. Or sees you on the couch, because we've not intentionally methodically create space for the dog to be independent. Yup. When a puppy is born, is this already in their DNA? Is this an instinct that they have? That you know they want to stay with the pack? So when they are separated from the pack? That's when the separation anxiety is triggered? Is that right? That they're just born with this? Absolutely Krista. Yeah, absolutely so yeah, let's capitalize on that right there. So you take the oldest relationship between an animal and human is what? the wolf Wolf, right? So you go back to cave person throws bone over shoulder, wolf sniffs bone and eats bone. caveman throws bone a little bit closer. Wolf get a little bit closer caveman gets to the point where you test the wolf. And now cave person and wolf start to go out together. patrolling looking for more bones. Right? It’s that simple. At a certain point the cave person says hey, you know what? Let's intentionally train this wolf to help me gather more food. So the relationship between human and wolf was just strictly for food. Then it became food and hunting you know hunting what hunting other humans hunting, food hunting for truffles hunting for whatever, right? So then, but then at that time, all of a sudden, the beginning of the wolf all the way probably until like the early 80s. You know, the relationship between human and canine fast forward from wolf to actual canine was you know I call it the basement dog or the dad dog. The dog that lived outside. Like when the dog was in the basement dog or the dad dog that you know it definitely before this there weren't tons of doggy beds in the 80s. Now a dog bed is just as expensive as a human bed. , Now there wasn't doggy daycare .there wasn't dog parks. there wasn't dog cafes. there wasn't dog friendly hotels in the 80s. Are you kidding me? check in me and Rufus. You know now condos… our condo has a dog park and we have a dog grooming salon. You know, I'm the resident dog trainer, you know .so as the relationship with wolf to canine changed and the dog became more of a true family member, meaning as I was saying earlier, my friend Dee completely admitted, I want my dog to sleep in the bed with me, period. And when i go out of town, I want a dog nanny that's going to sleep in the bed with my dog. That's a requirement. She said I love you…this just happened Tuesday… I love you. Why don't I take care of your dog? Toriano, because I know you're going to put them in a crate. And when I leave, I want someone who's going to sleep in the bed with them and cuddle with them the way I do. So because of that the relationship has become so close between canines and human,s we're not we're just out hunting with them. And you're a piece of equipment that is strictly used to hunt the rabbit and we're not hunting the rabbit. They're out in the shack in the back of the farm, you know, living next door to the pigs and the cows. Now that same Beagle is living in a high rise and its name is Annabel and Annabel has a dog bed in the living room. And then one in the bedroom. You know and Annabel gets to sleep in the bed occasionally, if not all the time. And we'll go into doggy daycare. So all these different things that made the dog say hey, you know what, you do all these things for me. when you're not there, you know what I'm gonna do? I'm gonna cry, I'm going to bark, right. Or if I associate the new baby with that reason that I’m not in the bed, then I'm going to maybe growl at that baby. or associate the new boyfriend and girlfriend with the reason why I'm not in the bed anymore. We're gonna bark and growl at them. Or if I associate you leaving the house, and leave me alone in this huge condo, to walk around by myself, when you come back, I'm going to destroy stuff, because you have trained me to be dependent upon you for everything. So that's why I would say separation anxiety, is pretty much I would say for sure. 50% dogs if not higher, because it would mean that a person understood dog psychology to a to a level that they would intentionally, not accidentally do anything that would create the anxiety in the dog that could be very costly and destructive, and life threatening to both that dog other dogs, other animals and humans. What a great point. Yeah, it is a different world on how we treat our dog. In fact, if I just interrupt you for a second. this just came to my mind. I can actually so I'll give you an example about a chow chow puppy that I have in training right now. That's like eight weeks old, right? But eight years ago, I trained a chow chow puppy and I told him, I told this woman, Hey, you know what, you're gonna have to really follow this to a tee because if separation anxiety enters this dog, it can become highly destructive, right? So fast forward, you know what would happen six years from now exact same conversation? the dog bit the mom really bad. Put about 20 stitches in her arm. Six years later from that same conversation I said you have to do everything to a tee, with this particular breed or really any breed, but specifically that breed because chow chows are some of the most dominant. Either, they're hunting dogs, they're fighting dogs, right? They have all that fur for when they fight, the other animal that is attacking them. They're not grabbing anything but fur. you have to really penetrate in order to get to their skin. That's how they were raised and developed. So but the dog bit the mom because that same client that I met six years ago, I saw that dog go from a puppy to where it was just the woman that was single, too. I watched her get the boyfriend. the boyfriend became the fiancee. then the fiancee became the husband. And they went from being newlyweds, to parents, all those different transitions. The dog finally said, Hey, you know what? It used to be just you and me. Lisa. Those days are gone. So when the mom came into the house, the dog’s like, Oh, no, I dealt with this guy. Who used to come around that went from a boyfriend to a fiancee to a husband and now a dad. Follow me? boyfriend, fiancee, right? Newlyweds, dad, right? What happened to our relationship? It was just you and I, Mom, right? And now there's this little creature walking around that was in your belly …because my sense of smell is 300:1. I know the day that he was conceived. Right? I know that it was in your belly. Right? And that's a potential threat too to me now because your body chemicals are changing. your estrogen levels are changing right? The things that made me want to follow you around now are changing. I don't recognize that smell. Oh wow now you just brought the thing that made that smell happen home? and now it's him? and that ,oh wait who is she coming into the household? Oh heck no, I can't do all this! Well, Toriano I'm gonna stop you right there so we can take a quick commercial break. I want to continue this story we're on a good roll here so we will be right back. 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 How to Have a Conscious Conversation in Discussions Over Your Dog | File Type: audio/mpeg | Duration: 00:32:43

Hello everyone this is Krista with episode #134 on the Wag Out Loud pawdcast. According to a new survey released by Netflix when it comes to watching TV, four out of five members have watched Netflix with their pet, and the majority ,which is 61% finds pets to be the best binge partner, beating out parents, romantic partners, friends and kids. What series do you binge watch with your dog? Welcome to the Wag Out Loud pawdcast, where we are obsessed with bringing you helpful tips on canine health care, nutrition, and overall wellbeing. If you'd like to support the show, check out the amazing online events, products and resources that I personally recommend on the Wag Out Loud website. I'm your host, Krista and I'm super excited to be bringing you yet another tail wagging episode. Debra Hamilton is an attorney/mediator/author who helps passionate animal loving people have constructive discussions.  She gets enormous pleasure when people use her process when in conflict, to start listening for understanding, really hearing an alternate point of view and recognizing what they have in common.  This helps everyone find an easier path to working out differences.  Starting from common ground enables differences to be more collaboratively addressed in a constructive & positive manner. Hello there dog lovers! I am so glad that you can join us for yet another tail wagging episode of The Wag Out Loud pawdcast. And I am thrilled to be joined by Debra Hamilton, and she is going to cover how to have a conscious conversation in discussions over your dog. Debra, I want to welcome you to the Show and for sharing this very important information with us. Can you please introduce yourself and tell us why you enjoy focusing on mediation for animal conflict? Well, thank you, Krista. Thanks, everyone, for joining us here today because it is such an interesting concept, especially now, post COVID, where everyone's last nerve is frayed. And sometimes we're not our best selves. So when we have a conversation, it doesn't always turn out the way we'd hoped. And sometimes you don't have to put the genie back in the bottle. So when I was a litigating attorney, the genie back in the bottle wasn't really a concept. But I found that a lot of people who were friends, who had been friends for years, would fight over a dog and lose that relationship. And had they just had someone in the room to help them look back at the good times they had look forward at what they had hoped to have in the future, and help them address what was bothering them now really had them save relationships. So I stopped litigating. I relegated my pumps. And I actually help people explore how they feel in conflict, how they would like to feel, and also explore how what they might have done, impacted the other party and reflect on how the other party might feel. And then we have a conversation. So I either do conflict coaching for one party to help them resolve it with my help, or I mediate both parties to still get together and have them resolve their conflicts. Sounds like you're a psychologist as well. Well, no. I don't play one on TV. I simply know that everyone has one common ground when a disagreement over an animal occurs. And that usually is that they think they want to do what's best for the animal. And what you need to do is pull that out and see how we can find a common ground. Well, Deborah, when you and I first met, you mentioned that many people don't really have a clear understanding of the different methods of resolution that are even available to them. And that's why they just go right to litigation. So with your help, let's break it down. Who are your typical clients? And what kinds of disputes are they having over their dogs. So my typical clients are pet owners, any kind of pet owners, but for purposes of our audience here, I'll stick with dogs, when you're getting divorced, or your relationship is breaking up. If you make a plan on how to share the pet before you dislike your ex. That's always more helpful than trying to do it while you're fighting over everything. So many of my divorce attorney friends say they get through the children, they get through the couch and the dining room table, but they cannot get through the dog. And I was interviewed for Bloomberg magazine. Oh God in 2016. And my quote was a bold quote, and it really still resonates today. Unfortunately, your pet doesn't hate your ex. Sort of like children, they don't really hate your ex either. So if you have a dog who doesn't like to go to a kennel, if you can work out having the dog go to your ex when you go on vacation, how great is that? But that does take getting over being right to getting it right. Because you want to get it right for the dog. You don't want to be right. You don't want to make sure you get everything you want. You want to make sure you think about what's best for the pet. I also do landlord/tenants. So we have disagreements with emotional support animals where they're allowed to go, what they're allowed to do. Also with animals of certain breeds, especially dogs, that you know, you have to have a conversation and really, landlords come to me to help put language together to help clients understand what the rules are. And then we had conversations between the landlord, the administration and the tenants to talk about what life with an animal in an apartment building should be because everyone really needs to accommodate everyone. It's not just me accommodating you. Are you accommodating me? I have a program with a colleague of mine, Gary Norman, where we talk about accommodating the accommodator. So if you're in a building with an emotional support animal, there are certain rules that you have to follow with respect to the people who are in that building. Who bought in that building, because there's no dogs allowed. You have to accommodate them. Yes, they're accommodating you, but you have to accommodate them, as well as that. It's a mutuality that never gets discussed. I also have breeder/owner, handler, rescue contracts that no one ever reads, ever. I tell you people walk through my door. And they either say I never read the contract because I wanted the dog and I was rescuing the dog. So why should I read the contract? And there are onerous clauses in there that nobody, nobody ever reads. It really makes for a difficult time for everyone. And I always say to people, please read it before, please ask questions. And if in fact, someone says to you, well, I never enforced that paragraph, then tell them to take it out. Nobody ever does. So these are the kinds of things that come to my office. Usually, people think to go to litigation, because it's a contract issue, I'll go to court, I'll enforce my contract, or I'll have the contract voted null and void. Well, this is a really expensive proposition Krista, as you well know, we've talked about this. So if you can get to a place where you can have a conversation with somebody holding a safe space for your side of the story, and the other party’s side of the story, you can often see where it went off the rails, put it back on the rails and go forward. Absolutely. And Debra, do you ever see situations where maybe a veterinarian is facing malpractice, or any pet service provider, you know, maybe a groomer injured a dog, you know, that kind of thing? Well, as I stopped talking about the cases I had, I said, Well, I didn't handle the groomer, the kennel or the veterinarian cases where dogs can be injured in their care. Because I could go on forever. On some of the things that I've seen, people have disagreements about dog walkers, dog groomers, veterinarians, vet techs, you name it, people have had disagreements with them, they all come through my door. And the good thing about what I do is I talk to both sides of the issue and work with them to teach them how to, if not be able to work, the disagreement out with Krista. Next time that disagreement comes up, they have better skills to handle it with the next person. And I have to tell you, most of the people who have come through my door, who have disagreements with veterinarians, usually just don't want it to happen to anyone else. I would like to work with a veterinarian, however, and I'm going to say this, in all honesty, truthful, the veterinarian likely wants to speak with you. But unfortunately, I'm an attorney. So I can say this, their attorneys won't let them. So then you have to go through their malpractice insurance, which is not in the business of really making it easy for clients to get a discussion or any sort of satisfaction or information about what happened to their pet. That's not what they're in it for. And so it makes it really difficult. And then it escalates. Unfortunately, it gets the veterinarian, who would probably like to sit down to talk to you, but is handcuffed by the insurance companies. I have three cases like that right now. And I'm working with attorneys to de escalate so that the clients cannot spend $10,000 on litigation, but rather find out the information they should be given. It's absolutely imperative for them to understand what happened to their pet. And then to have everyone decide what is the best interest and outcome going forward? What kind of protocols Can I help you put into this doesn't happen again, what kind of protocols are you going to put in? And let me know because most of the pet owners want to be part of the solution if you invite them. But that isn't something that's commonplace in veterinary medicine yet. I'm working on it. You go girl. Well, as you said it in all of our lives, it would be so nice to be more proactive. But human nature is more Oh, that's not going to happen to me. So, I love what you're doing in saying, yeah, it could and might and possibly will happen to you. So we need to have measures in place so that when disagreements do happen, again, it's human nature to just have emotions skyrocket, you probably can't think clearly, your negotiating skills are lacking. And that's where you come in. So I just love what you're doing. Are there other people like you that just focus on animal conflict? Are you one of the few? Well, I'm one of the few that don't take it immediately to guns, you know, go to litigation, write the nasty letters and start the whole thing, because you make a lot more money if you litigate as an attorney. However, if that's not what I'm in it for, I'm in it to help my clients have closure. I want my clients to have closure. I want them to be heard, respected, understood, so their point of view, have the ability to have a conversation so they hear respect and understand the other party's point of view, be it their breeder, be it their veterinarian, be it their groomer. And then we find a way forward. So for me, the process you want to put in place is I call it stop, drop and roll because it's easy for when you're in this negative place, and everything is really blowing up in your brain. Stop talking and listen. There was a gentleman on the other day who said, You know, I always tell my clients Oh, it was the Sisters in Law. They were discussing negotiation, which is the first piece, which just has people throwing out ideas on how we can make this work doesn't necessarily ever listen, but throw out ideas. So the the Sisters in Law podcast, they said, Well, you know, I'd really just like to have someone listen first, because if you listen first, you get a lot more information. And if you ask open ended curious questions, it really makes it clear what you are looking for, because you're hearing all the information you need. So the first part of my conflict resolution playbook is stop talking and listen, and listen for understanding that responds. Krista, you and I have talked about this before, most people listen just to get those zingers in. And that's that short term high conflict response that Amanda Ripley speaks about in her book, High Conflict. If you want to make a resolution, if you want to move forward in a more positive way for both you and the other party, then you want to have good conflict where Yeah, you can disagree. But you can disagree in a way that keeps the animal your main focus in the animal is thriving under your discretion, not standing still. I mean, I always say that the Ringling Brothers litigation was outstanding except the elephants stood still and didn't get anything and some mediator worth his salt would have at least had the ability to have Ringling Brothers do certain things to make the elephants lives easier, year by year by year, just by having a collaborative conversation. And that never occurred. So for me, stop talking and listen is important drop the need to be right. Nobody makes you wrong, you are right. the way you're perceiving information is correct. And then when you get more information by listening, you can even be even more correct and make a better decision. And then I always say that sometimes people say things in the heat both you and the other party. So you know, let it roll off your back. And if you've said something that you wish you hadn't do the right thing and say, You know, I think I need to back up and recognize when I told you this, this and this, that was really very destructive to our finding a way through this conflict. So I want to apologize. It is amazing when veterinarians apologize or clients apologize, how they make such better headway toward resolution and solution, which not only helps them for their pets, but helps pets in the future. This makes so much sense and we can use this information in so many parts of our lives. Debra, we are gonna we're gonna take a quick commercial break and we will be right back. Sponsor Ad I'd like to thank our friends at HAPPYBOND for sponsoring this episode. HAPPYBOND is not your average joint supplement, but a patented collagen building formula that gets real results within weeks. 99% of dogs taking HAPPYBOND have realized improvement in mobility. It's backed by science, clean, human grade functional nutrition to help your dog stay healthy throughout their lifetime. Loaded with exceptional ingredients to help support joint and hip health, energy, digestion, skin and coat. This tasty supplement just gets sprinkled onto your dog's food. And within two weeks, my 12 year old dog Winston was no longer going on walks. He was running! Yes, running like a puppy! Thanks to HAPPYBOND, he obviously feels better and has so much more energy. See for yourself how HAPPYBOND can extend the health span of your dog by going to HAPPYBOND.com and be sure to use the code WOL20 for 20% off of your order. We are back with Debra Hamilton and we're talking about how to have a conscious conversation in discussions over your dog. And we left Debra talking to us about her stop, drop and roll. And how do we gain these listening skills, Debra, because many of us don't have them. You know what it starts with grieving. I know everyone’s big buzzword now is being mindful. But you really do have to be mindful and grounded and recognize that the more information you allow yourself to receive, instead of giving, the better informed you will be for going forward. So I always tell my clients, you want to be the one who listens first. Because then when you go back to Krista to talk to her after she has dumped her bucket, so to speak, you can point out at the beginning of that conversation where you agree, we agree that we love Fluffy, we agree we want the best thing for Fluffy. We agree that the outcome was not what any of us wanted. And so these are things that we have in common. And I want to just highlight that for you. So right there, you defuse the fury, at least a little bit. And then you can address the things, you know, was it my fault? Was it you know, some congenital thing, whatever it is, was it the you know, the dog jumped and cut his paw or whatever at the kennel or at the groomer or whatever it is that you're arguing about? You know, there are things that occurred and the art of having an educated conversation has been totally lost. And that's why I've mentioned it before, but serves it deserves mentioning again. Great book by Amanda Ripley, she wrote High Conflict, she talks about how you can get so much done. If you engage in good conflict. It's like good trouble that John Lewis would tell you to get into good trouble is where you good conflict is where you want to make sure you are listening for understanding. You're asking for confirmation of what you're hearing, you're reflecting back what somebody says so that they know you heard them. And then that really diffuses the situation. I always tell my clients, I want you to go I want you to listen, I want you to take notes. I want you to tell Krista what you heard her say, and then say to her, you know you've given me so much information here. Can we talk so today's whatever day it is, two, three days from now we talk two or three days from now at a similar time and really delve into what I found what I think and nine times out of 10 people will say fine, the only problem is then Krista you have to call that you have to because it does two things one, it allows you to digest the information you receive. And it allows you to craft a less argumentative, more collaborative conversation going forward. Makes complete sense. So in the eyes of the law, our dogs still considered property? Well, in divorce law, in certain states, they're being elevated to something more than a chair because they do take the well being of the pet into consideration. So that would be Illinois, California. I think New York is even contemplating it, and Alaska. However, for all intents and purposes, especially in veterinary medicine, and in grooming and in a kennel, they're still considered property. And so you know, we all know that our pets are not our chairs, they are our companions, they are family members. So to us they're much more but they have not changed under the law yet. What you need to do is you need to make sure that if you're leaving your dog with anyone or make sure you know who they are, most people do more investigation and quality analysis on buying a refrigerator that on the kennel that they dropped their dog off at the groomer they dropped their dog off at or the veterinarian they dropped their dog off at or even worse, the rescue they rescued their dog from the shelter they take their dog from or the breeders they get their dog from. So if we did as much homework on getting our dogs as we do or getting our refrigerators, we would be much better off. You're right. So are you suggesting that we have our dogs in our wills or in our trust for the what if something happens to me? Well, I'm so glad you brought that up because some of the biggest conflicts that come up are what happens to the dog. If something happens to you? Every Wednesday night at 6:30, I hold a free call. It's called a MAAP community call where we talk about navigating the journey your pet takes. That’s. why it is called a map. And your your pet takes when something happens to you, because most people put everything like you just said in their will. And I'm a little flippant, you and I both know that. So I always say, I'm glad you know, you're going to die. Because if you don't die, the terms you put in your will will not come to fruition to care for your pet. So let's think about that. So I had a serious accident, I'm in a coma. I'm suffering from dementia, I'm suffering from some disease that makes me too weak to care for my dog. But does that mean I don't want my dog with me while I'm trying to recover? Absolutely not. The reason I made this plan because I broke my ankle, and I had nine dogs and nobody to care for them. My husband said he was caring for me, not nine dogs, which was legitimate, right. But I just always assumed nothing would happen to me. It's like pulling teeth though. And I know my trust and estate colleagues Don't even ask about this, when people come in, they do put the terms in the will. But they don't talk to people about making a plan making a pet trust outside the will that kicks in in case they break their leg. And they have to hire someone to take care of their dog, or they have dementia, which means they'd like their dog to stay as long as it can with them. And maybe their entire life as long as they're able to live with it safely, right. And pay somebody to come over and take care of it a neighbor or something like that. And if you have disease, if you're fighting cancer, there's so many commercials, we've all seen them where the people come home to do the new commercial, right, and the dog is there while she's having the treatment on her arm at home. And I go Yes, and my mom had cancer and I'm telling you that you don't feel very well when you're going through chemotherapy. So you might not be able to walk the dog or feed the dog regularly. So that's another time where you need to put people in your plan for your pet to care for your pets, that leaves a pet in place because you really want it or not even I don't think we have time enough to go into what you need to do if you live in California with the fires, what you need to do if you live in Louisiana with the hurricanes and the floods. The tornadoes in the Midwest, you know, so many things that you have to plan for for your pets. Because some people really get angry, how could they ever leave their dogs behind during a hurricane, you know, with the flooding? And they go because they didn't make a plan to go somewhere that would take dogs. And if your dog isn't crate trained, you know this Krista, if your dog isn't crate trained, they will take it to the shelter. And so a lot of people are you know, anti crate. But if you don't have a crate trained dog, they can't go to the shelter, right. And there's only a certain number of dogs who can go and shelter. So if you have the ability to go to a hotel, you need to know what hotels are close enough or out of harm's way early, not late, make a reservation that you can cancel if you don't need it. But that you can make sure you can get away with your dogs. It's just simple planning for the what ifs. It is for the what ifs and and the thing that drives me nuts, I speak to a lot of trust in the state attorney. So everyone on this call and you go to your trust in the state attorney to make your will tell them. I'd also like to talk to you about a Pet Trust. Now it could cost maybe depending on where you live $1,000, $5,000, $1,000 probably, you know the South. $5,000 in New York and California. But it's really well worth it because it really sets you up to take care of your pets, whether you're dead or alive. So it really is an important piece that you need to have. And I always tell people if they come to the MAAP community, and if we have or we have two day weekends where we do all of the work, so you can take it to your trust or state attorney and say this is what I want in my Pet Trust. Because people just don't know what they don't know. But they know what they want. And there's so much that people don't think about I mean, so if you're a big breeder of dogs, where do you want those dogs to go? Who do you want to get them? If you have one dog? Who do you want to get them? And if you've bought a dog from a breeder that is co-owned, are you able to give that dog to your neighbor does the contract say you have to give it back to the breeder. And if it says you have to give it back to the breeder if you have a transparent conversation with the breeder and then leave it with the neighbor because that's the best way to the dog. These are all kinds of things we talk about. Yep, avoiding conflict. There it is, again, that conflict. Yep. You mentioned that you have a MAAP community call every week. Can you talk to us about this genius thing called the MAAP Blueprint that you've created? So the MAAP Blueprint is all the documents you need to put together to hand to your trust and state attorney so they know what you want. So it stands for something which is why it's called MAAP. that we all make mnemonics for things, right? So the M stands for MAKING A PLAN, we have to first sit down to make the plan you want for your pet? Do you want your pet to have extraordinary means taken to keep it alive? If it gets very sick? Do you want your dog or cat to live everyday to the fullest? And then when they give you that look, do you want them to be put to sleep? they need to know. So that's the make the plan, you need to then address the needs of each of your pets. If you only have one, It's simple. If you have like four or five, every single dog has to have their needs addressed. So what medications they're on when they're young, probably not much when they're older, more, are they afraid of thunder? Are they good with other dogs? Are they not so friendly to strangers do they run away all the time, all that information makes it so much easier for those dogs to be re homed in the right kind of situation. So many dogs, you and I both have seen on the Internet of constantly posting where people have passed away and the dogs have no home and the family can't take it. Most people believe their son, their daughter, their niece or nephew are going to take their dogs and cats and sometimes they do. But sometimes they can't. So what you want to do is you want to make sure you have a plan in place that you make the plan you address the needs of the pet, what's the pet good at you appoint caregivers. So those would be one family member and two or three others. So the others would be a neighbor who’s nearby, or a rescue that you got the dog from or a rescue for that breed of dog, or the breeder of that dog, whomever is going to be available to take that dog and make sure to either keep it for the rest of its life. Or make sure it's re homed if that's what you need. And then when you write all this down, you have to PUBLISH IT. that's what the P stands for in MAAP. You have to publish it with your attorney, you have to publish it with your vet, you have to publish it with your family and all the caregivers. So they all know who they are. So they can make sure that if they can't rise to the occasion, they know the other two or three people who are your caregivers that they can reach out to. So there's always something there. And now with COVID It seems that you need to have your next door neighbor be the first line of defense because if you're taken to the hospital, because you're ill so many dogs were taken out of apartments because people went to the doctors here in New York, went to the doctors were admitted to the hospital. The neighbor took care of the dog for a week or two but then said enough’s enough called animal care and control Animal Care control took the dog, the dog was held for the statutory period of time five to seven days. And then it is given to a rescue and once the rescue gets the dog. If there's no way I mean you're on a ventilator you're not calling so they don't know who this dog belongs to, or if this dog's been abandoned. And so they place it once they place it. As all of you who have rescued a dog, you cannot get that dog back. So if I get sick and I come out of the hospital two months later, and my dog’s have already gone through the system, I will never see it again. That would be a bad day. That's a very bad day for so many people. Yeah, but it's reality. it happens every day. And people don't know it. I mean one woman broke her hip and she was asking what animal care and control is doing. She had a beautiful, beautiful Afghan nine year old Afghan she'd had since it was a puppy and they said oh it'll be here when you get out. It wasn't it had been put through Afghan rescue was adopted and and she was devastated. She was 79 years old. This was her last dog that was nine years old. And you know we talked about this before we got. on the call but people have different opinions. And so some of the people said well you shouldn't have had a big running Afghan at 79 years old. it needed a young family. that really isn't part of the conversation we need to have. those are the kinds of things that are what would Amanda say, they’re conflict hijackers. they really just see that conflict and so we really need to make sure we keep our pets with us if we can. Well that is a great close right there. Again, this is the MAAP. that's M as in Mary, A , A, P as in Paul Blueprint. And Debra you have shared some great information that we all need to think about if we love our dogs, we we have to think of the what ifs. So Debra, where can everyone find out more information about you? Hamilton Law and Mediation and you're a podcaster as well. you have the Why Do Pets Matter Podcast? Yes, I do. So they can go to hamiltonlawandmediation.com or they can go to whydopetsmatter.com One word .com. and come and listen to some of the podcasts. we talk about. why pets matter and why people get into Krista, like you who's going to get why people get into the pet industry, why pets matter to them and how they Help people live better lives with their pets. And often I talk to attorneys who think being able to have this conversation, which is my first love. Making sure people can have a conversation, when they're angry about something that involves the animal is the best way to save the animal. And I guess everybody on this call would be really into that. They want to make sure whatever is best for the animal is what happens. And that may be what they're thinking. But I always say there's my way, there's your way, Krista, that and then there's a third way that's even better. I love it. Well, Debra, thank you so much for all that you do. I think we're giving listeners a lot to think about. And I encourage everyone to check out Debra. And again, that's hamiltonlawandmediation.com. Debra, thank you so much for being here today. Oh, you're very welcome. If any of the listeners want to come to a MAAP program, just go to hamiltonlawandmediation.com you can sign up. We don’t sell anything. So you're not going to get lots of emails except we'll let you know when every one of the Wednesday evenings come up so that you can either attend or listen later. They're all recorded.     Instagram: @WhyDoPetsMatter          Facebook: www.facebook.com/HLawMediation/          LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/debrahamilton413         Twitter @HLawMediation         Podcast WHYDOPETSMATTER.com Sounds great! Thanks again to the team at HAPPYBOND for sponsoring this episode. See why dog behaviorist, Cesar Milan also recommends this incredible formula by going to HappyBond.com and use the code WOL20 for 20% off. Thanks for listening. You'll find some helpful links in the show notes and if you enjoy the show, please be sure to follow and listen for free on your favorite podcast app. And please, please share your feedback. Visit WagOutLoud.com for great product recommendations with discounts, amazing online events and fantastic resources. That's also where to visit our Bark About it page where you can suggest topics, guests or products. Be advised that this show offers health or nutritional information and is designed for educational purposes only. You're encouraged to do your own research and should not rely on this information as a substitute for nor does it replace professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. If you have any concerns or questions about your dog's health, you should always consult a veterinarian or a nutrition expert. Have a tail wagging day and we'll catch you next time. Hey Winston was that another tail wagging episode?

 Breaking the Chain: Facing the Nationwide Dog Neglect Crisis | File Type: audio/mpeg | Duration: 00:37:01

Hi this is Krista with episode number 133 on the Wag Out Loud pawdcast. have you checked out all of the amazing partner products that I highly recommend? These are products that I have tried, tested and can totally recommend that will help your dog to thrive. Just go to WagOutLoud.com, and check out our Partner Products section. And I've negotiated discounts for most of the products, so why not see what can make a difference in your dog's life? Have you ever wondered, what are cataracts in dogs? So canine cataracts happen when the proteins of your dog's eyes clump together and form a cloudy film, which actually blocks light into your dog's eye and may cause some vision loss. Over time, the proteins continue gathering and the entire lens becomes cloudy, which could lead to total blindness. Most dogs’ cataracts are hereditary, and there are more than 100 dog breeds known to get cataracts. Welcome to the Wag Out Loud pawdcast, where we are obsessed with bringing you helpful tips on canine health care, nutrition, and overall wellbeing. If you'd like to support the show, check out the amazing online events, products and resources that I personally recommend on the Wag Out Loud website. I'm your host, Krista and I'm super excited to be bringing you yet another tail wagging episode. Daphna Nachminovitch is the senior vice president of cruelty investigations for People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals. She oversees the group’s low-cost spay/neuter clinics, which have “fixed” more than 187,000 dogs and cats since 2001, and has successfully worked with government officials to pass laws banning or restricting the chaining of dogs in several cities, as well as in the state of Virginia. She also directs PETA’s field team, which provides neglected dogs in southeastern Virginia and northeastern North Carolina with custom-made doghouses, straw bedding, toys, and other services. Its work to help neglected “backyard dogs” is the subject of a recent documentary, Breaking the Chain, from executive producer Anjelica Huston. Welcome dog lovers! today we are going to be chatting with Daphna Nachminovitch. And she is the Senior Vice President of cruelty investigations for PETA. And she's going to be talking about breaking the chain facing the nationwide dog neglect crisis. Daphna, I am so thrilled that you are here. We've had this on the schedule for a long time now. Could you please introduce yourself and share why are you so passionate about rescuing abused and neglected dogs, I'm sure this is something that you see these disturbing situations in your line of work every single day. Yes, and thank you, Krista, so much for having me. It's wonderful to be here. My name is Daphna and I've been with PETA for 24 years this month. And, of course, one of my passions is dogs and ensuring that their quality of life is what it should be. And in our line of work at PETA, we see dogs and other animals who are deprived, not just of basic necessities of life, meaning food, water, shelter, and veterinary care. But of all that is natural to them and what they need in order to thrive and be happy and have joy. They don't have companionship, they don't get to exercise. And they don't have any interaction that's meaningful with humans. These are dogs that we serve through a local program I'll go into in a bit. But we're talking about dogs who are relegated to the outdoors 24/7, usually at the end of a heavy chain, or even a tether or in a pen 24/7 in the same tiny patch of dirt. And these are the dogs that I hope through my work and others work, PETA’s work to achieve a difference of life and death for them by opening people's eyes to their plight, and hopefully getting legislation passed that makes it illegal to keep dogs outside chained up like an old bicycle. Yes. And we just we can't imagine. Because of course everybody listening today, you know, we love our dogs, they're part of our family, we pamper them, we try to do everything for them. So this neglect and abuse. You know, it's just not even in our minds that human beings can be so cruel. Dapha Is this right? I've read that close to 65% of all abused animals are dogs. And every year more than 10 million animals die from abuse and that's just in the United States alone. Is that what statistics you have as well. I'm not personally familiar with that statistic, but I'm sorry to say that it would not surprise me one bit. And that's why the movie Breaking the Chain about the plight of these dogs is really so vital and important for people who care about dogs to watch. I know it's you know, I've heard people tell me, you know, I don't want to watch something sad. You know, it's gonna make me angry. It's gonna break my heart. I'm gonna cry. And the thing is that we are the people who have the power to make a difference for these dogs. And if we can't even bear to watch what their daily lives consist of, then imagine what their daily lives consist of, you know, we can make a change for them by lobbying for legislation, by reporting cruelty when we see it, by trying to help them hands on with programs like the one that PETA runs called Community Animal Project. And it's the people who are listening to this podcast who can affect change. So I plead with everyone, please watch this movie. It's available for free on Prime Video. And it's also available on other platforms. But Prime Video is free. And it's only an hour. And while it may make you a bit sad, it will also motivate you. And more importantly, it will make a difference to the dogs that we all love. You are so right. And this film was so well done, even though it is heart wrenching. We do have to open our eyes, you know, this is happening in our own backyards. So I'm glad that you're here to chat about this, because we do need to make a change. And thank you so much for you and your team for wanting to make a difference. And especially with legislation. That is what we need. So why don't we talk about this documentary? I just love it was produced by Angelica Houston. Yes, the actress. So how did this project and film come about? Well, that's an excellent question. So this is actually a culmination of months and years of dedication to trying to get the word out about what these dogs go through day in and day out. And we really wanted to open people's eyes to their plight, tell people about our program and what it accomplishes for these dogs, and really inspire people to take action in their own backyard. Because there are dogs like this, not just in our immediate area where our program services, there are dogs like this in, you know, across the United States. And I had a you know, a mayor that we were lobbying in one of the small towns we serve, and we tried to lobby him for a tethering ordinance, meaning an ordinance to ban continuous chaining or tethering of dogs, without someone being outside with them to prevent dogs from existing 24/7 365 days in all weather extremes outdoors. And this mayor in this tiny town in North Carolina, and he was totally unaware that there was a problem in his own community, because he just didn't look to the left or the right. When he went about his daily business going from work to home, or what have you. And after we met with him, he said to me, you know, now that you've told me about these dogs, I see them everywhere. And so I really took that to heart, because to me, that means is that, you know, they're out there, and we just need to look for them. And so this documentary is really designed to inspire people who care to do something, it doesn't have to be, you know, starting their own program, although that would be wonderful. But even just reporting something that they see, or offering to walk a chained dog who doesn't have anybody else to speak for them, delivering straw bedding in winter when it's cold, to prevent them from freezing to death. Little things, you know that can make a difference of life and death for these dogs. And if you watch the documentary, and I know you did Krista, but I really urge everyone to watch it. There are uplifting moments, there certainly are moments that, you know, make you sad, but the uplifting moments, you know, are there too. And there are dogs who get rescued. There are dogs who have been kept chained or pinned for many years and then somebody decides to do the right thing and give them to us or the dog is ailing but treatable and they give them to us. Or sometimes the dog is ailing and not treatable, and we still are able to end their suffering. But it's really designed to inspire people to take action, even from the smallest step to the most sweeping step. I do think that within two there are people who will do the right thing because it's the right thing. But there are people who will not do the right thing unless the law tells them that they have to. And we have worked very hard and continue to work very hard to get unattended, tethering banned everywhere, not just in our service area. But in our service area. We have the individual dogs stories to share with public officials because we visit those dogs. So we can really speak very intimately about their plight and we can speak to their plight when we find you know, we have found dogs who have perished of heatstroke or were frozen to death. And we always make a point of using those stories, you know, to inspire public officials to do the right thing. And so we want to make it so that it is illegal in our country to keep a dog tethered outside, like an old bicycle. And I know this sounds like a totally foreign concept to your listeners, because as you mentioned, their dogs are inside, on the couch, watching TV with them sharing popcorn. But the reality is that there's a, there's a real crisis of care for other dogs. And some of them, you know, from puppyhood, to death, spend their lives in one tiny patch of dirt, with nothing to do, no stimulation, and not even basic necessities of life very frequently. So we want to prompt change with this documentary, we want people to watch it and get inspired and get in touch with us, and ask us what can I do to help? And we will tell them. That's great. How do you find these dogs? Do people report it? Run me through exactly when you learn about a certain dog? And the steps that you take to try and save that dog? Yeah, great question. So our program is well known now in our service area, which is comprised of, we kind of say is a two hour radius from PETA’s headquarters in northern Virginia. And we serve southeastern Virginia and northeastern North Carolina. And so the counties that we that we serve in North Carolina are very impoverished and have no services in some cases and, and the services that there are, are not affordable for the folks that we visit. So we have a dog house program, it's a free dog house program, and people can see more about it at https://www.peta.org/, where we build custom made dog houses, for dogs who spend their entire lives outside. And sometimes that's the best that we can do for them. But it does get us kind of a foot in the door. And so people will call us, they'll call us for dog houses, they'll call us for food, they'll call us for free straw, they might have seen our billboards in the community, they might have seen our vans which have our number on the side, they might have seen our dog houses, which also has a toll free number on the side. So people can call, we do get people reporting on neighbors and others and dogs they're concerned about. But for the most part, we get calls from people who want some kind of free help, whether it's a dog house, or straw, or food or veterinary care. And then once we're in the community, we're kind of like the ice cream truck, we get flagged down by people. Or we get you know, we get stopped at gas stations, we get flagged down in mobile home parks from people who say, Can you give me this? Or can you can you look at my puppy, I think he's, you know, got a skin issue, that kind of thing. And so we actually, the program has expanded and we visit 1000s and 1000s of dogs every year. And these are dogs that we keep visiting, you know, so there are multiple dogs at some addresses. There are dogs, new dogs, dogs we have known for a long time. So we go into these communities, we discover new cases, but we also revisit and do what we call rechecks on dogs, whom we've been visiting for months or years. And, you know, we really do our best to get these animals relinquished so that they can have an opportunity at an indoor life. That's our our ultimate goal is not to have dogs be kept outside. We try to educate we try to educate by example. You know, we try to encourage people to take their dogs for walks and we show them how to you know how to groom, how to trim nails, how to clean ears, how to make sure that the collar is not too tight. And really, that's how we we find our clients. Okay, well, Daphna, this is fascinating, and we have more to talk about, but we are going to take a quick commercial break and we will be right back. SPONSOR AD A special thanks to the team at Tickless USA for sponsoring this episode.  I am so thrilled to share this great company and their products with those who want. To prevent ticks and fleas without the use of toxic chemicals.  “That’s right! No more toxic chemicals need to be applied to your dog! Tickless devices are ultrasonic flea and tick repellers that emit a series of ultrasonic pulses that humans, pets and wildlife can’t hear. These outstanding patented products are the #1 selling chemical-free repellents in Europe that are proven safe in multiple studies. They offer various versions to be worn on the collar and they also have units for the home. You can’t go wrong with these environmentally friendly, chemical and fragrance-free ultrasonic devices, making them perfectly safe to use for your entire family.   Order your tickles device today by going to ticklessusa.com and use the discount code wagoutloud (that’s all one word with no spaces) to receive 15% off of your order. Welcome back, everyone, we are in the middle of an amazing conversation. It's hard to have but necessary. Daphna from PETA is talking to us about breaking the chain: facing the nationwide dog neglect crisis. So Daphna, you were just telling us about what you're doing with this program in these communities. I guess the first thing that comes to mind for me is, do these people have any business owning a dog? Why do they have a dog? If it's not part of the family? What is the dog doing on this small patch of dirt to enhance their lives? If I only had the answer to that question, you know, we ask ourselves that question every single day, why do they have a dog? And we actually ask them, you know, because it is perplexing. Why would you seek to have a social pack animal, and then keep that animal in isolation and deprive that animal of everything that is natural to him or her, you know, essentially, you know, condemning that animal to solitary confinement, I don't have the answer, I can only tell you what people tell us. You know, some, some people think that that's the way to love a dog, they've never had a dog who lived inside, it's a totally foreign concept. to them. It's more of a possession of an animal rather than a you really, as you and I would consider our dogs as members of the family, who are individuals who deserve respect and consideration. There are people who say that they have the dog because the dog barks when somebody comes by. There are people you know, security, safety, it's obviously nonsense, because if an animal is penned or chained, first of all, they're less bonded with you and less likely to protect you, they're just bored. So they bark. But it's also a very archaic and inhumane way of viewing an individual animal. And so we do, we try so hard to talk to people individually, one on one, on what dogs need, not just physically, but emotionally. And to me, the emotional aspects of what we're seeing out there, this crisis of care. I mean, it's all awful, and it's all compelling. And it all keeps me up at night, right? But the emotional deprivation, and knowing, you know, looking at an animal, when I or one of my team members go out and meet an animal, we see an individual, you know, with a personality, and, you know, just different aspects, you know, silliness, fear, you know, exhibiting different behaviors, and the people that we deal with, you know, they don't see what we see, they're not looking at that animal and reading that animal in the way that we read them. And so it's very hard through to get through to them on a level that they just haven't reached, you know, so why they, certainly to answer your question. I think many, if not, most of the people we visit, really don't have a business having a dog. Because if if you're not willing to provide a dog or any other animal for that matter, with what they need to have joy not just to have life, then you really mustn't acquire that animal, that animal depends on you to make their life worth living. And the dogs that we visit, who are tethered, who are, you know, trapped at the end of the chain, no matter the weather, all the time, and sometimes tangled and can't reach their water can't reach shade. You know, these are not animals who have lives. I don't even like to say that they live at the end of the chain, I just say they exist at the end of the chain. Because what they have is not a life. It's just breathing. And so many of them that we see I was in the field most of last week, and it was in the 90s. We're in southeast Virginia and it is so humid. It's like you're walking through soup, hot soup. And these poor dogs. Every dog that we saw was panting panting so heavily too hot to even bother to eat, desperately looking for shade. Just you know, could not get comfortable. As we all know, dogs can't sweat they can overheat very easily if they're in full sun. And even if it's just really hot, and they don't, you know, they can't cope. If they have health conditions or they're elderly or they're very young. You know, their lives are in danger just from from the heat. And it just makes you crazy to see these animals and not be able to tell the people it's illegal to do this, you know, it should be illegal to keep animals, tethered, penned, or really, even outside, when the weather is, is a certain temperature or certain weather conditions. And that's what we ultimately want to see is our local governments or state governments, and ultimately, our federal government is take action to protect dogs, whose owners and I use that word purposefully instead of Guardians whose owners don't do what they are supposed to do. So you're saying, because there is no litigation in place that none of these people, these abusers, we can't file any criminal charges against them? It's just nothing we can do? Well, you can, you know, it depends on so different states have different laws on the books. And most certainly, there are towns and counties that have passed such legislation. And I would say that an animal control officer who is motivated and wants to do the right thing can most certainly, as a general rule, interpret the law to protect an animal. And so I think it all depends on the level of enforcement, the language of the law, but in certain areas that we visit, where it's rural North Carolina, and the town has not passed anything, you know, beyond the basic state law, which is that the dog has to have food, water, and shelter, is that just because the dog is tethered, and it's hot, if they have food, water, and shelter, then there are no violations provided that the dog is in acceptable physical condition, and the chain isn’t tangled and that kind of thing. But the concept of keeping an animal trapped at the end of the chain is not illegal, and it absolutely 100% should be illegal. What has been the worst case that you've ever seen? Oh, man, there are so many horrible cases. I mean, about this kind of thing. I think for the dog or animal in question. Their case was the worst case, you know, my perception of their life is not, you know, it's not, it's not their perspective, because they only know their own suffering. And so, to me, it's all horrible. You know, I mean, we we have had, I mean, the worst thing, as far as I'm concerned, is prolonged suffering and mental anguish. And I don't know that I would say something is necessarily the worst, but I have, you know, a number of dogs who, whom I've known, you know, over the years, and whom I lost a tremendous amount of sleep over. And, you know, and they died, they died at the end of the chain, because the person wouldn't let us take them and the authorities wouldn't act. And, you know, these are things that that haunt you. And there are also dogs that by the time we do get custody of them, it's really too late. They've just, you know, either they are, you know, in advanced, you know, deadly stages of congestive heart failure from untreated heartworm disease, which is so common where we are here, because it's, you know, it's swampy and there are a lot of mosquitoes, or their mental state is just broken, they're just their spirits have been broken. And we actually have a couple of dogs right now in foster care. And one of them came from a situation that, you know, really breaks my heart, because we tried to get these dogs there were three of them. And we tried to get them for years, literally years since 2016. And their owner finally died of COVID in January. And it was very sad because he was actually even though he didn't do right by those dogs. To him, that was the best he could do. You know, he kept the dogs tethered, but the dogs were fed and they were watered, and he was an elderly gentleman, and he was terrified of getting COVID and he went to visit a family member and he just never came back because he got sick and he died and we thought when that happened that we would get custody of these dogs but his family insisted on keeping them tethered behind this empty house. And a few weeks ago we went there and anyway we had been checking on them since January since his passing and really pressuring the family to let us have these dogs. one of whom is essentially you know, really, very kind of feral dog at the end of the chain very, you know very frightened and loses bladder and bowel control when you touch her and just really awful. Just has never been socialized even her own even the man couldn't touch her. And when we arrived a few weeks ago, one of them had lost 40% of her body weight. She was skeletal and she she was a whit dog but she was covered in coal dust. And we finally, you know we that was the last day we visited we just we got in touch with the daughter who lives in Maryland, these dogs are in North Carolina. And so we told her we would be removing the dog that was done like that we're not going to be showing up and finding a dead dog at the end of the tether, right. And it's wonderful that we got the dogs but this this one little dog, you know who lost all this weight and she's in foster care right now. And we called her Pancake because she always did this kind of pancaking from fear. You know, when you approach her, she would just pancake to the ground. And she's coming around in foster care. But she has a secondary skin infection from an untreated flea infestation, her teeth are worn down to the roots from chewing on her skin for years, so they'll need to be removed. She's got advanced heartworm disease. So she's on doxycycline right now to get that kind of pre treated before the injections. But most of all, behaviorally, you know, she's terrified, she's terrified of walking on floors, it took her 10 days to figure out how to take the stairs, she's afraid to go outside. You know, she's really food possessive, I mean, all of these behaviors. And it just breaks your heart to think like this dog, you know, if her life five years ago, when we first asked this man to let us have these dogs, you know, she would have been a different dog. But this kind of constant deprivation and isolation has created an animal who needs so much, you know, so much attention and nurturing and patience. And thankfully, she's in a wonderful foster home with one of our staffers with two other PETA rescues, and those little dogs are kind of teaching her how to be a dog. But it really breaks your heart to think of the psychological impact, the physical impact is much easier to fix than the psychological impact. And to me that, you know, that's a soul killer right there. I can't imagine. Okay. Um, do you guys also investigate puppy mills or dogs used for laboratory testing? Or what about these gambling rings that have gambling for dog fights? Do you get involved in all that as well? So we do actually do undercover investigations. And we haven't done a puppy mill in a while. Because I think awareness raising has been successful to some extent, and we're always keeping our eye out. But and also the opportunity hasn't presented itself, we most certainly investigate laboratories where animals are experimented on dogs and other animals and, and breeding facilities for the purpose of experimentation, as well, as you know, really, any situation in which an animal is being exploited. If we get a call about it, or if we are trying to expose an industry, we will go in and investigate. So we, you know, on PETA.org, people can see our undercover investigations. And one thing that may be of great interest to your listeners is that two of our more recent investigations in the last couple years involve blood banks. And I don't know if people know this, but greyhounds who are used are basically discarded by the greyhound racing industry, are generally then sold to blood banks. And essentially warehoused in crates, and used for blood draws, that are then used in blood donations. And so we shut down a blood bank in Texas a couple of years ago, and then we exposed another blood blood bank, which is still in business called Hemopet. And that's in California. And we are working on legislation presently in California, that would allow community blood banks to exist, which is people who have large calm dogs who don't mind, you know, at quarterly or twice a year, having blood drawn so that it can be donated to an animal in need, you know, for transfusions or what have you. We're trying to get legislation passed in California that would allow that because California is the only state that doesn't allow it. But that's something people can take action on if they go to our website https://www.peta.org/ especially California residents. This is really timely for that. Oh, I never knew that. Yes. Oh, yeah, it is a more than we know. Yes. And if you think about that, I mean, I'm sure many of your listeners have rescued greyhounds at home. These are gentle, wonderful, really intelligent dogs. And you know they need to run they need to have stimulation, they need companionship, and praise and have them if you look at our investigation of Hemopet, they basically sit in crates, and the only time they come out is to have a needle punched into their jugular. And it's Cruelty to Animals plain and simple. We did complain to the state of California. They, in our estimation, they didn't do an adequate job of, of investigating that, but we're very hopeful that this legislation will get the job done. Well, thank you so much for your work. I knew this was gonna happen. We're out of time. And we have to have you back. That's pretty much where we are. And hopefully, you know, probably better news. No problem. Well, let me come back when chaining is a thing of the past? Yeah, like a little time capsule somewhere, right? Oh, my gosh Daphna, I can't thank you and your team enough for the work that you're doing. I mean, you have the biggest heart, but you have to also have an iron stomach to witness all of this. So I guess before we sign off here, how do our animal neglect numbers compare to those in other countries? Oh, God? That's a tough question. There are no such statistics. Really, I think that different countries deprive and neglect and abuse animals in different ways. I am for one, always surprised at the things I see in our own country in the United States. Because we do I think we regard ourselves as a nation of dog lovers and “animal lovers”, but we do horrible things to animals every single day. And I think that other countries, certainly are in that same boat in different ways. There are countries for example, you know, in, in Europe, well, not all of Europe. But like in the United Kingdom, our office in the United Kingdom says chaining is not a big problem there. There are other problems. Sure, penning is not necessarily one of them. So I do think part of the big picture problem that we face, just humans in the world all over the world is, you know, thinking a lot about ourselves, instead of trying to regard other animals, including dogs, as individuals and trying to understand what they're telling us. I think, you know, if you think about it, dogs don't make their own choices, we tell them when to eat, when to pee, you know, when they get to go outside, when they get to go for a walk. And that's, you know, that's a lot for an animal to give up. I know they've been domesticated. But I think, you know, for me even something as not allowing your dog to sniff when you go on a walk, because you're on your phone and you're distracted, or asking, you know, making your dog sit in the waiting room at the vet's office when they're stressed and terrified. Those may seem like little things, but for that dog, you know, they matter. And so I think there are little things that we can all do to make the dogs whose lives we touch better, you know, let them sniff as long as they want. It's their walk. And if they're stressed out at the vet's office, then let them stand up. It's not yours. So you know, yes, I am with you. Oh, my God. Yeah. Well, Daphna, I think what we can take away from this is that we, you know, we're thinking Oh, little old me, what can I do? But we can all together make a difference. So what can we do? Tell us what to do to go to https://www.peta.org/? And what do we do there? Yeah, absolutely. So go to PETA.org And email us. If you have any questions, you can always shoot us an email. But I think number one for listeners is watch the movie Breaking the Chain. Yep, that will really kind of give you an idea of what we're dealing with. And, and from there, there are pages on our website that will tell you how to start your own program, and little things and bigger things that you can do for dogs. And you can certainly if you email us and say that you listen to this podcast and you want to get more involved, just mention my name in your email, and that email will get to me and I will make sure you get the help that you need. If you want to start a program, if you want to do straw giveaways in the winter, if you want to find a way to get free food out in poor communities, we will help you figure out how to do that. We will guide you and we will make sure that you have all the tools that you need. So don't hesitate just send us an email or you know, contact us through social media mentioned in this podcast, mention my name and we will get you the help you need. Wonderful! well I will also put all of the contact information even your social media information in the show notes. So we urge everybody to do something make a difference. Don't sit on the sidelines. And Daphna a huge thank you to you and your team for fighting this fight for the dogs that you know I'm about to cry just thinking…Thank you Oh, you're welcome. And thank you so much for having me on and helping us spread the word about this. I think it's a problem we can conquer, but we need more people to get to join the battle here. Absolutely. Well, Daphna, thank you so much, and hopefully better news next time that we have you on. Yeah, thank you, Krista. Thank you. We want to again thank our friends at tickles USA for sponsoring today’s episode and for making such incredible products.  Why not order your dog a Tickless device today by going to ticklessusa.com and don’t forget that the code ‘wagoutloud’ (no. spaces gets you 15% off)  Thanks for listening. You'll find some helpful links in the show notes and if you enjoy the show, please be sure to follow and listen for free on your favorite podcast app. And please, please share your feedback. Visit WagOutLoud.com for great product recommendations with discounts, amazing online events and fantastic resources. That's also where to visit our Bark About It page where you can suggest topics, guests or products. Be advised that this show offers health and nutritional information and is designed for educational purposes only. You're encouraged to do your own research and should not rely on this information as a substitute for nor does it replace professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. If you have any concerns or questions about your dog's health, you should always consult a veterinarian or a nutrition expert. Have a tail wagging day and we'll catch you next time. Hey Winston was that another tail wagging episode?

 Real Animal Protein Without the Slaughter | File Type: audio/mpeg | Duration: 00:33:05

Hello everyone this is Krista with episode number 132 on the Wag Out Loud pawdcast. did you know that hypoallergenic dogs don't really exist? It's usually not a dog's fur that causes allergies, but his dander and the protein that it carries. yes, there are dogs that shed less fur, or don't shed it all. But that just means the dander is less mobile. So dander is even released from hairless breeds. Of course, various breeds produce different types of dander so you can be more allergic to some dogs than others. The bottom line is, according to scientists, you can't breed away the protein in dogs that causes allergic reactions, and so hypoallergenic dogs do not exist. Welcome to the Wag Out Loud pawdcast, where we are obsessed with bringing you helpful tips on canine health care, nutrition, and overall wellbeing. If you'd like to support the show, check out the amazing online events, products and resources that I personally recommend on the Wag Out Loud website. I'm your host, Krista and I'm super excited to be bringing you yet another tail wagging episode. Rich Kelleman is the Co-Founder and CEO of Bond Pet Foods, a Boulder, Colorado-based start-up that’s working with biotechnology to make pet food from real meat protein like chicken, turkey and fish, without the animal. Before diving into the world of pets and food tech Rich was a VP and Director at some of the world’s most respected advertising agencies including CP+B, FCB, and Fallon, where he led brand strategy for Burger King, P&G, Kellogg’s, and Coca-Cola, among others. Rich has a B.A. in Marketing from Boston College, with additional study at Stanford University’s Center for Social Innovation. Hello dog lovers! We are so glad that you are here and want to be the best advocate for your dog's health and wellness. Today, I am joined by Rich Kelleman, who is going to share some fascinating information on real animal protein without the slaughter. So Rich, thanks so much for taking the time to be here today. Why don't you introduce yourself and tell us why are you on this mission to find alternative protein sources for our dogs? Hey Krista. great to be here and excited to share a little bit more about what we're cooking up with Bond. So I'm the CEO of Bond Pet Food. And we are working with food technology to make pet food from real meat protein like chicken, turkey and fish without the animal. And it sounds a little bit sci fi but you know, as I explain a little bit more about what we're doing it something that is, in some ways, this technology been around for more than half a century to make things that we enjoy and eat every day today. But we're just reassembling that process, in our case to make meat protein that can serve as a primary source of nutrition in the dog and cat’s diet. So at a very high level. So what we're doing is we're using a process called microbial fermentation, or precision fermentation. And what that is, is it is a brewing process of sorts where we work with yeast and other fungi to make proteins, and the vessel and the fermentation tank that have the characteristics and composition that we're looking for. Other applications of this technology are for example, the industrial production of enzymes for cheese manufacturers that are used in cheese making to separate the curds and the whey. Historically, those enzymes have been procured from the fourth stomach of a baby calf. Decades ago, there was a lot of slaughter and harvest to get at those enzymes that could be a high quality input into the cheese making process. But then, some smart scientists realized that instead of getting at those enzymes and making them in a way that was land, water, energy intensive, it could basically take the DNA from a baby calf, isolate the material that would express and produce enzymes that were important for cheesemaking insert that DNA into a microbe like a yeast, and then as they put that yeast into a fermentation tank, feed it simple sugars, vitamins and minerals. I'm oversimplifying the process, but as the yeast grows and the enzymes for that cheese grow as well, and they're able to harvest it from the fermenter once it reaches a certain density, dry it down and then use that ingredient in the production of cheese in that environment used today in almost 90% of all cheese that's manufactured in the United States, even organic cheese, whether people know it or not. So we're Following the same process and protocol, just with a little bit of rejiggering to instead of making that enzyme to make meat proteins that could, as I mentioned, serve as the foundation of a dog and cat food recipe for their pet health. Can I stop you there Rich for a second? Because I don't know if everybody knows the current state of the pet food industry and why you are looking at alternatives for protein sources and you are blowing my mind. By the way. Can we back up just a little bit? Because a lot of us know that much of the meat currently found in pet foods, especially the low cost products, comes from animals that are known as the four D or the dead, dying, diseased or disabled, that are unfit for human consumption. Can you briefly talk about what factory farming is and why it is so awful, not only for the food, I use that really loosely, that word food that is being created and how it is impacting the environment? Yeah, no, it's a great question. Apologies. sometimes I geek out on this stuff. We're gonna get back to it, believe me. Yeah. So it's a fundamental question. And that's really, what is a reason for our being and what problem we're trying to solve. You know, we're not anti meat, we think that meat can be a beautiful thing. For dog and cat nutrition, it gives them all the essential amino acids that they need to thrive. It's highly digestible and bioavailable. But the production of meat comes with a host of environmental safety and animal welfare downsides to satiate the demand that is required to feed a growing pet population here and abroad. There was a study that was done by some researchers at UCLA a few years ago that tried to get a better understanding of the environmental impacts of meat consumption by America's dogs and cats. And so they looked at the supply chain, all the inputs and outputs of production, when it comes to land, water, energy, greenhouse gas emissions, you know, toxins that just are part of the, the waste stream of the harvesting of meat. And a couple of conclusions that came from that study, I think, are eye opening. number one was just from the calculation that if America’s dogs and cats are their own country, their consumption of meat products alone would rank fifth in the world, our dogs and cats are voracious consumers of meat. And the second point related to the sustainability and environmental impacts of this production was that up to 30% of all the negative impacts associated to meat production when it comes to greenhouse gas emission. And resource use. up to 30% of those negative impacts can be attributed to meat production for our dogs and cats. So I think there's it's true that a lot of dog and cat foods don't necessarily have the grade A prime steak, right, that's number one on the ingredient labels. But even taking that into account and considering the resources that are required even to make byproducts that are used in pet food, it still has a material impact when it comes to resource intensity, negative environmental impacts, not to mention the farm animal welfare impacts to be able to harvest those ingredients that are used in pet diets today. So that is really why we're trying to find a better solution to make meat in a way that's more efficient and responsible. There is another layer that you mentioned, which is that meat ingredients, especially in the pet food industry are hard to trace. In terms of their origin. A lot of meat meals are often key inputs into an ingredient deck in many pet food recipes. And the origin of those meals and within them is it's not always very appetizing. You know, there are a number of recalls every year when it comes to conventional pathogens that are just part of commingling in meat processing with salmonella, listeria, E. coli, and the like, but also weird things end up in the meat meals and supply chain. You know, zoo animals have been found. The DNA of zoo animals have been found in, in pet food. The euthanasia drug that's used to put down dogs and cat has also been found in pet food, which indicates that actually dogs and cats are maybe in the food supply chain as well. I’m not saying that is totally true in the sense that every bag of dog food that you get is, you know, there's a danger of that having that in there. But it has been traced, in some instances to being in pet food. So our ability to produce these meat proteins in a cleaner, more responsible, efficient way, while ensuring because we're growing it in a controlled setting that that has zero chance of entering the food chain and supply chain that's also a giant benefit of, you know, ultimately what what we'll be able to bring to the world. Wow, that's amazing. Well, I'm excited to chat with you more about this amazing technology and what you guys are doing. We are going to take a quick sponsor break and we will be right back. SPONSOR AD We are so grateful to the Original Mine Pet Platter for sponsoring this episode. This has to be one of my favorite products ever!  The Mine Pet Platter is designed to benefit the health and well-being of your dog and promotes the ultimate natural feeding experience for both meals and treats.  What is it?  Well, it’s a patented, bone shaped platter designed for your dog’s feeding instincts.  It includes scoops and ridges that naturally slows your dog’s eating routine and makes mealtime fun.  After watching my dog Winston slow down instead of inhale his food from a bowl, we’ve never gone back.  Now he explores, sniffs, paces, walks around the platter and licks it clean!  Its BPA free, made in the USA, dishwasher safe, sustainable, recyclable and has a 100% money back guarantee.  There are too many benefits to fit into this ad, so I encourage you to learn more by going to https://minepetplatter.com/ and learn that how you feed your dog is just as important as what you feed them.  And as a bonus, Wag Out Loud listeners can take advantage of a 10% discount by using the code WOL10 at checkout! Welcome back everyone. We are chatting with Rich Kelleman from Bond Pet Food. And we are talking about real animal protein without the slaughter. And I don't know about you guys, but I am just blown away with everything that Rich is sharing with us. And before we go into Bond Pet Food and what they're doing with this amazing food technology, Rich, what do you think of the plant based protein dog foods that are out there? Yeah, I think there's definitely a role for plant based nutrition in dog food products. Not necessarily cat food for primary nutrition because cats are obligate carnivores. But there is certainly a way to calibrate from a formulary and nutritional standpoint, a primary dog food recipe in a way that will give them all the essential amino acids and requirements they need to thrive. But it is a difficult challenge, in part because many plant based proteins possess anti nutritional factors. And what I mean by that is, while on paper, it may look like they're giving them the full robust nutritional profile that they need to be healthy. Some plant based proteins actually prevent absorption of other micronutrients. So if it's part of their diet day and night, for years, it could over time, present some challenges that rear their head a little bit further down the line. So I think having plant based ingredients, and perhaps a vegan recipe as part of a broader diet. I think it has merit, and we're fans of that to a limit. And that's why, you know, we're another reason why we're going about seeing if we can reimagine the way that we make meat to be included into a pet’s diet that is just made with greater integrity and more responsibility because if we could do that, give them the same meat protein that's just as bioavailable as its conventional counterparts. But without all the downside And then we think we have a better solution than just, you know, from what may be available off the shelf with plant based foods and resources today. Sure, no, that makes sense. Well, let's dive in a little deeper about this fermentation process. You You said this technology has been used for decades in making cheese and beer. So how do you really grow the animal cells to create the end product, the protein that you're talking about? So we're starting with chicken meat protein, and we're starting with chicken because it's the most consumed meat in the world for people and pets. I think it's in 80% of all pet food recipes in some fashion that are out there today. And so what we do is, you know, we, in our instance, we took, and this is a long story, but I'll just give you a taste of it. So we wanted to when we were looking at growing and producing our chicken being able to point to the chicken that was the origin of our ingredients, not just that, oh, you know, we were able to get a sample from any random chicken and then be able to grow and harvest, you know, their, their protein in our fermenter. What we did is we actually took a trip to this heritage chicken farm in the dead of winter. And to Lindsborg, Kansas. And we went to a heritage chicken farm because heritage chickens in a conventional sense are raised with a great deal of respect. You know, they're free range, they grow slowly. They're not engineered chickens, they have a lifespan up to eight years. They're just treated. You know, when we're talking about conventional agriculture in a way that I think is representative of our ethos. If you're going to eat or consume meat from an animal, that's one that you you'd want to look for. But we took this trip to this heritage chicken farm, we interviewed chicken, we picked one out of the lot that we thought, you know, could be representative of the origin of our chicken and we took a harmless blood sample from her. She's still alive and well and roaming free on the farm. And we're making sure that with with the farmer that she can live her natural life without harm. But then what we do is we from that blood, we isolate the skeletal muscle DNA, which is the building blocks of meat, and then we insert that DNA into a yeast, like a saccharomyces yeast, baker's yeast, put that strain of yeast into a fermentation tank. And so just think of literally it looks when it’s at scale, just like a brewing tank that you'd find in a brewery. We see the yeast that's in there simple sugars, vitamins, minerals, and nutrients that it needs to grow. And as it grows, the protein, the chicken protein, the meat protein that's inside of it grows, so that as it gets into its full density, just like you, you know, if you're brewing beer or something else, you get that frothy liquid in the instance of beer or the cheese enzymes, you get, you know, a protein that reached a certain volume, right, and it's ready to harvest and we pull that out of the bioreactor or the fermenter. Gently dry it down, grind it up, and then we're left with a concentrated meat protein that can be blended into a recipe or extruded into a kibble, freeze dried, dehydrated or baked into a treat. And again, it does sound when we're talking about how food is made, I think many, including myself included before I really began and started on this journey. The mechanics of this sounds pretty foreign, but it is a process whether you're talking about beer or whether you're talking about enzymes for cheese, good bacteria for probiotic supplements, for example. It's made through a similar process. the heme protein. And the impossible burger is actually made in a similar way in the sense that they're brewing these microbes to produce heme protein that's usually found in meat that gives meat its flavor. That heme is something that's made through a similar process of microbial fermentation. But again, we're reassembling the process. We're not producing any of those ingredients. We're using this brewing process to yield and harvest meat protein through the process that I described. So it's a tried and true method, I think we're just doing it in a unique and perhaps transformative way to reimagine how meat protein is made from a from a pet nutrition and pet health standpoint. And right now, if you walked into our food lab in central Boulder, you just see these vessels with like bubbling percolating percolating tanks. And we're, we're making batches every week, just so that we can understand how to grow them grow these proteins in a way that gives us the exact protein composition that we're looking for. And that makes sense from a commercial standpoint and a unit economics standpoint. So sure, that's what we're toiling away with every day with that process development in that work in our edit in our headquarters. Wow, that is crazy. And you're saying that the end product includes all of the essential amino acids that dogs require for optimal health. But it would be the same exact amino acids as if we were to take that original chicken that you mentioned. Absolutely, yeah, it's nutritionally identical. And just as bioavailable as what you would find. And if you were harvesting these meat proteins in the conventional sense on farm and field. And that's what you know, we're excited about because we know we haven't done a full lifecycle analysis on this yet, because we haven't scaled up the protein. So lifecycle analysis is basically looking at the equivalent land, water, energy requirements to produce a kilogram of meat our way instead of raising, you know, chicken on a farm and looking at all those various inputs, looking at them side by side and seeing what's more efficient. Also, greenhouse gas emissions and the like, just to see how much lighter we are on the planet. But we know, for example, from parallel industries and approaches, or go back to the enzyme for cheese manufacture, just because it's, it's easy to draw a straight line to. But in that instance, the process of making those enzymes is 90% more efficient when it comes to land, water and energy intensity to make the equivalent material and through that process, than it is in a conventional sense. So we were pretty confident that when we come out the other end, we'll be seeing the same types of efficiencies. Wow. And Rich, since this is such a groundbreaking product and process, how are you going through the regulatory process through the FDA and AFFCO? Yeah, so we have just started the process of working through the FDA and Center for Veterinary Medicine, engagement. This is something that will take a considerable amount of time, because we want to make sure that we can demonstrate performance, safety and efficacy and show that it's identical to the chicken meat proteins that are on the market today. So we've just begun that dialogue and that conversation, we will be doing a pretty robust amount of just like any new ingredient would feeding trials with dogs and cats, to show what the uptake looks like, you know, how they eat it, how it's processed in their bodies, in terms of stool quality, how it impacts qualitative measures, like their energy, hair and coat and a host of other things. So we'll be really looking at this with rigor to make sure that when we come out the other end of all that that we get the FDA, the CVM and AFFCO’s approval for use in food, but that also we and the public can have confidence that this is something that could be the mainstay of their of their best friend's diet. And are you going to share your product with other pet food manufacturers as the base protein ingredient? Or is this something proprietary that you are just going to make your own food with this science? Yeah, that's a great question. I initially it would be something that we’ll include in our own brand of products, in part because once we start producing and we've gone through all that development work and regulatory work, it's not like we're going to be producing 1000s and 10s of 1000s of tons. Now it'll be something that we’ll slowly start to ramp up production. So easier to introduce it initially in Bond’s own branded products. over time, this is definitely something that can have broader utility and the high quality protein that the likes of Nestle and Mars and Hills and others could could get some real benefit out of. And we do have good relationships with all those pet food manufacturers, I think all of them right now are looking at their own supply chain security and how they could satiate the demand of a growing pet population. And they know that our approach and approaches that others are taking to alternative proteins, whether it's cricket protein or other plant based sources, they're all interested and exploring that for their own portfolios. So over time, there'll be something that will have broad use and application, but initially, it would be just in service of our own our own brand portfolio. Okay? And do you, when do you anticipate that your products with this technology will actually be available? Our goal is to have them in market by the the end of 2023. Okay, so we're still a couple of years out from having this in the hands of people and in the mouths of dogs and cats. But in the meantime, what we're doing, and we're going to really start introducing this initial offering the back half of this year and into next, we're introducing what we just view as bridge products. So for example, we have a beautiful dog treat bar. It's like a candy bar. And in one sense, not in terms of like we're not feeding dogs chocolate, but it's, it's in the form, it's in the form of a candy bar like profile, so it has pure microbial protein. So think of a dried yeast as a hero ingredient that is an amazing ingredient, just for a protein digestibility. bioavailability has some other great characteristics to dried yeast, nutritional yeast, like B vitamins and the like. So that's the hero ingredient in that initial bar. And the reason that we're starting with these initial products that don't have our proprietary meat proteins, but have other proteins that are made through fermentation, like the yeast is so we can begin to educate the public about the beauty and merits of proteins and products that are made through this approach, kind of get them comfortable of thinking about this new way of feeding and nutrition. And then when our meat proteins are ready in a couple of years time, they've had some assemblance of you know what these microbial proteins how their dogs, and cats may respond to it. And it'll be an easier bridge for them to give it a try for beyond treats. something that can be the primary source of of their nutrition, day and night. So we have a protein packed dog treat bar that we're going to be reintroducing in a couple of months made with yeast, we're going to have other conditional formulas, like a bar for gut health, a beauty bar for hair and coat that's made with micro algae, as well as yeast, and then a bar for joint health as well, that could really help dogs that have you know, are fighting with those types of ailments, just then being able to as they age is, you know, different breeds of getting up and down and going on the hikes as they were when they were a bit bit more of a pup. So we have a whole host of products that we're going to be launching in the interim and that we're just as excited about but the more ambitious products and the things that we think are going to be even more transformational are the meat proteins that we've been talking about this, this entire podcast that are right around the corner. Oh my gosh, this is so exciting. And thank you to you and your team for thinking outside the box and pushing science and new technologies. And I'm just so excited to see what you guys are doing. And it sounds like a very bright future for our planet and for our dogs and cats as well. So as we wrap up Rich, I would like you to just share with everybody Where can we find out more information about you and everything that Bond Pet Foods is doing and the things that are coming on the horizon? Yeah, I think it's the same cast of characters that that you might expect. at our website on Bondpets.com There's a shop page with the products that are available at the moment and that will you know, we'll have a full suite of dog treats initially that will be I think, worth looking at and exploring for The dog parents, over the next six months, we have a presence on Facebook and Instagram. Links: IG, Twitter, Facebook, Site And that's where you'll find a little bit more of the play by play of how things are going in our food lab and our progress with all that work as well as some of the other partnerships and product announcements. So yeah, I encourage anybody who's interested in looking at what the future of food might look like, and perhaps, if you're interested in giving us a try, I would love for you to bring it home. And, you know, tell us what you think, you know, there's, there's a, we're excited to share our story and introduce some of these products in the weeks and months ahead. This is great. And I want to be a part of your journey. So I am going to put all of these links into the show notes so that everybody can keep apprised of everything going on at Bond Pet Foods. So Rich, thank you so much for sharing this exciting technology. I am so excited about the future. So I really appreciate everything that you're doing. You bet. Thanks, Krista. That's a great opportunity to chat with you and to be on your show. So thanks so much for giving us this forum to share our story. Well for any of our listeners that want to try out any of the Bond Pet Foods initial products that Rich just mentioned. Use the code WOL10 to receive a 10% discount plus free shipping at Bond Pet Foods Thanks again to the team at The Original Mine Pet Platter for sponsoring this episode.  Check out the ultimate mealware for all dog foods by going to https://minepetplatter.com/and be sure to use the code WOL10 for 10% off! Thanks for listening. You'll find some helpful links in the show notes and if you enjoy the show, please be sure to follow and listen for free on your favorite podcast app. And please, please share your feedback. Visit WagOutLoud.com for great product recommendations with discounts, amazing online events and fantastic resources. That's also where to visit our Bark About It page where you can suggest topics, guests or products. Be advised that this show offers health and nutritional information and is designed for educational purposes only. You're encouraged to do your own research and should not rely on this information as a substitute for nor does it replace professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. If you have any concerns or questions about your dog's health, you should always consult a veterinarian or a nutrition expert. Have a tail wagging day and we'll catch you next time. Hey Winston was that another tail wagging episode?

 What in the World is a Livestock Guardian Dog? | File Type: audio/mpeg | Duration: 00:31:56

Well hello there! This is Krista with episode #131 on the Wag Out Loud pawdcast. I just learned this about how dogs greet each other, and I just had to share it. Female dogs are more likely to greet other dogs by smelling their snout or their muzzle first, while males go for the genital region. So pay attention on your next dog walk, you might be able to quickly determine the sex of the other dogs who greet your dog, just based on this behavior. Give it a try. Welcome to the Wag Out Loud pawdcast, where we are obsessed with bringing you helpful tips on canine health care, nutrition, and overall wellbeing. If you'd like to support the show, check out the amazing online events, products and resources that I personally recommend on the Wag Out Loud website. I'm your host, Krista and I'm super excited to be bringing you yet another tail wagging episode. Hello dog lovers and welcome to yet another informative episode of The Wag Out Loud pawdcast. And I am so excited to learn from our guest, Jan Dohnor who is going to enlighten us on what in the world is a livestock Guardian dog? Jan, I'm so glad you're here today because I never knew that there was such a thing as a Livestock Guardian Dog (LGD). So if you could introduce yourself, and tell us all about it, you know what got you interested in these specific types of dogs. Jan Dohner is an author of Livestock Guardians: Using Dogs, Donkeys, and Llamas to Protect Your Herd; Farm Dogs: 93 Guardians, Herders, Terriers, and other Canine Working Partners; and The Encyclopedia of Animal Predators. Jan lives on her family farm and has 40 years of hands-on experience with the use of livestock guardian dogs for predator control and working farm dogs. Jan is also a longtime member of the American Livestock Conservancy and the Kangal Dog Club of America. Hi, sure. I'm a librarian and an author and a farmer. And I live on a small farm in Michigan with my husband, we've been here quite a long time. And one of the things we were doing on our farm was raising to start breeds of livestock. And we were starting to have problems with predators. And then this sort of light bulb went off in my head that I had remembered when I was a girl and madly in love with dogs. And like many other kids, that I had read about the Great Pyrenees, which was a Livestock Guardian Dog from France, and most people are familiar with the breed. And all I could think of was, that's what I need, right? This was back in the late 1970s. And the idea of using these ancient breeds for their purpose again, which is as a working as a Livestock Guardian Dog was just starting to come back sort of into public consciousness. This was not a thing that we had done here in America or Canada. This is an old world tradition, mostly among people who take flocks up into the mountains, you know, in the summer to graze, or people who are migratory with livestock, and they're native to a sort of a band of countries from Spain, and Portugal, Southern France, Italy, and all the way on over into Central Asia. And it's all these same types of people. Well, back in the 70s and 80s, when our native predators began to be, you know, resurge themselves, because we were now protecting them, right? People here in America thought, you know, we're gonna have to think of, you know, sort of sustainable living, non violent sort of ways of living better coexisting with predators. And this idea of this old world job for dogs, which was, as a Livestock Guardian, you know, started to come back and all over the country in the 80s. And 90s, people started, you know, thinking about this again, and writing about it and groups started getting together and talking and I guess, I was kind of in that mix from the beginning. And I've gone on to write several books about dogs, working dogs, I've written a book about the use of Livestock Guardian Dogs, and other livestock guardian animals, and farm dogs in general and historic breeds of livestock. So these two things are kind of intertwined. If you believe that there's a way for us to live in coexistence with nature, this is a good solution because we aren't really, you know, trapping or hunting predators, we're finding a way to live together with them. Right. And when you say predators, what kind of animals you talking about? Um, anything from small predators. If you if you raise poultry, you you know, might be dealing with things like raccoons, right, or foxes or something small, or even hawks. If you raise sheep or cattle, we have sheep. We have problems with coyotes, for instance, right? We have problems with other parts of the country. There's a lot of problems with larger birds of prey with lambs or calves. And then, of course, out in the more range areas where adult animals are preyed on by larger groups of coyotes, maybe together wolves, bears, mountain lions, you know, all these things have made a comeback, right? And we're living closer to them. And we're trying to figure out ways to live together. And for the most part, Livestock Guardian Dogs are a deterrent for predators visiting your property. Rather than, you know, a violent confrontation that you would have with them. Okay. Well, that's good. I like it. Okay, well, I have a million questions, and I'm sure our listeners do too. So why don't you first tell us what is the difference between a Livestock Guardian Dog and a herding dog? Good question. And it makes sense that lots of us don't understand these differences. Because this is, like I said, a farming or ranching tradition that we grew up with, right? This is something that we're coming to new. So Livestock Guardian dogs are actually a more ancient type of dog than are herding dogs. Back when early man started keeping sheep and goats and cattle and things, they needed ways to protect them, right? And so you started using dogs to help you when you're up in the mountains or something. And this is so old that the ancient Roman writers wrote about Livestock Guardian Dogs, and the native dog of Italy, the Livestock Guardian is the Maremma and the way they described the Maremma 2000 years ago, they would recognize today's Maremma, it's that much the same dog, right? They were giving the same kind of advice like, you know, what your dog should look like and how he should behave and what kind of a good shepherd you should buy your dog from so that he would behave properly. So this is a very ancient, you know, type of dog. Herding dogs were developed later, when we began to keep flocks mostly in Great Britain is the home of many of you know, the Border Collie and those kinds of things. And they weren't dealing with predators so much anymore. They don't have large predators and herding dogs became the shepherd’s companion in places like the Pyrenees mountains in France, a shepherd would still have his Livestock Guardian Dog will probably also have a small herding dog, a smaller dog to help him move this flock. The names are all very confusing because Livestock Guardian Dogs were originally called sheep dogs or shepherds in their homelands, because these herding dogs weren't developed until later. So they're different than modern sheep dogs or shepherds that, you know, that we think about, and they're very different in behavior too because herding dogs have so much energy and Livestock Guardian Dogs are about the opposite. herding dogs are very, you know, they want to please you, they want to follow directions, they learn lots of words. Livestock Guardian Dogs, very aloof and independent dogs and don't follow, they’re self thinkers, and they don't follow directions. Well, so there is that difference. I think that a lot of us think of farm dogs, because that's the tradition here in North America. And they can be from a wide variety of breeds, right? They were companions on farms to families. They did a little bit of a lot of different things. But they weren't dogs bred specifically for this job of living full time with livestock and thinking on their own and protecting them just sort of instinctively. And that's where the difference lies, although the name sort of overlaps frequently, right? That breeds The Great Pyrenees is the one I use, for example, a lot because most of us are familiar with what a Great Pyrenees looks like. And they very much are like most of the Livestock Guardian Dog breeds, which are all very large. They tend to have floppy ears. They tend to have curly tails. The early shepherds were breeding for a kind of dog that didn't look like a wolf, you know, they wanted a dog that looks sort of blended in with the flock. Frequently they're white. Sometimes there are other colors, but it's interesting in some of their homelands, if they're dogs that are, you know, sort of fawn colored, well, the sheep were that color too or the coats, right? They were looking for an animal that blends it in, right, so maybe the predator wouldn't know that there was a dog there. So they are, like I said, very independent thinkers, they're strongly protective, low in energy. They have very little chase drive or prey drive. We always laugh that when you go to pick a Livestock Guardian Dog puppy out, you know, people throw a little ball when they're picking out another puppy to see if the dog you know will respond to them, bring the little ball back or engage with them, right? With a Livestock Guardian Dog. Even a grownup one, if you throw something, they just kind of look at it go well, I guess you didn't want that right. They have no interest in bringing something back to you and they just don't have those same drives like that. Today, there are some other breeds that if you're a dog person you might be familiar with because the Komondors have been around in the Kuvasz. They were dogs that were here in North America for you know as companions or show dogs or something. Now there are lots of breeds because since we began using them, we have brought a lot of breeds in from Europe and Central Asia. And you might have heard of the Akbash. It's a white, Livestock Guardian from Turkey and very popular in range situations like there are a lot of them in Texas and Oklahoma and places like that there are other dogs from Turkey called like the Anatolian Shepherd and the Kangal dog, which is the breed of dog I've raised for a long time. There's other dogs from Spain and Portugal, there's the Estrela Mountain Dog, which some people might be familiar with, because you see that as sort of a Home Companion sort of dog too. there's the Spanish and Tibetan Mastiff. And they're not really mastiffs. Same thing, we're, you know, dog names aren't always accurate right? people call them something, but they're really a shepherding dog, right? Both of them. And then there's some that are a lot more rare that you're not likely liable to run into much, but they're going to all resemble each other in a sort of major way. They're all about 80 to maybe 140 pounds, they tend to have heavy coats, because they live outdoors much of the time, although some of them do have short, dense, warm coats, but they're always double coated, because they need to be warm and protected from the elements, right? They almost all have curly tails. Although some cultures in Europe and Asia with bobbed tails, you know, on dogs and stuff. they all have floppy ears, they don't none of them have stick up ears. And they kind of look like big overgrown puppies, even when they're grown up if you you know, picture a Great Pyrenees. That's a common trait of how they look. Well, I've read that you mentioned that Livestock Guardian Dogs are usually very independent. I've read that they're typically stubborn, single minded, and focused solely on the herd. So yeah, are they also good pets or not so much? They can be a good companion dog in the right home. And I mean, their ideal home would obviously be a family that was either on a farm or ranch, or just lived in a rural piece of property right, where the dog was going to have enough room for exercise. And not be, it had something to do all day too. They are very frustrated if they're kept in a very small yard, or in a house, and they tend to bark a lot then, because normally they're outdoors and what they're barking at, or sounds they hear, like maybe a predator that might be nearby or another strange dog or something. And that's their alarm system. So they're going to do a lot of that, right. So in a small yard, or a house or something, they're going to be far more frustrated, because they're they're a working breed like other working breeds, and they need something to do and for them, it's to be outside and something to protect, and they need to be well fenced, they will roam off, because what they're doing is like trying to really patrol out looking for potential danger, right. And they all came from cultures where they were not kept fenced in anywhere, they were all up somewhere in the mountains or on, you know, grazing land with shepherds and stuff. So this idea of patrolling out and around is kind of built into them and sort of hardwired, so if you’re going to keep them you need a good fence. I think a couple of the biggest things that when people think about them for companion dogs is that you really have to educate yourself and understand these basic things about them, because you're not going to change them, they are going to be strongly self thinking dogs, you know, they their job was to live alone much of the time and make decisions on their own. So I don't know if it's stubborn, or if it's a matter of that they feel like whatever they think is important. Maybe more important right now, you know, right now, maybe what you want, you're not going to get that same kind of response from them, that you would from like a herding dog, right? That wants to be your companion all day long and do everything with you. They're also going to be strongly protective. And that's just hardwired in too. this is what they do that says this idea of protecting something, whether it's your family, or the yard, or your property, or you know, the sheep or whatever, that's their job, and they inherit this. And to keep one as a companion, you need to be prepared to deal with them, right? you aren't going to be able to change the basic traits of a dog just like you can't change the basic traits of a herding dog or a hunting dog. You know, so you need to be well prepared for that. The owners inability to control the dog right or to keep them contained in a yard. And the barking are the biggest reasons that livestock Guardian dogs are turned into rescue, where people have been trying to keep them as companion dogs. You need to be that kind of family that or person that's going to enjoy your dog for what he is right? Not going to be a dog that's going to be comfortable going to the dog park, because these are all strange dogs. If they feel like that the strange dog is threatening you. They're just going to react the way they do and it's defensive, you know, and it's not that they should be uncontrolled. No, they should be socialized and They should be leash trained and they should be all those things. But this is still their basic nature to protect something. Jan, I'm gonna stop you here real quick, we're gonna take a sponsor break. I am just loving this because this is all things I didn't know. So we will be right back. SPONSOR AD A big shout out to The Doghood for sponsoring today’s episode. The Doghood is THE ultimate dog lover’s community that  helps trainers, behavioral specialists, and dog owners unite to discuss various issues regarding dog care.  This is a remarkable platform and smartphone app for dog owners and by dog owners.  The moment you download the TheDogHood mobile app, it will connect you to all the dog owners and dog lovers who have downloaded the app both in your neighborhood and also from around the world. You can ASK questions , create events and share cute pictures of your pup all with a click on the app. theDogHood will make owning a dog even more enjoyable with the AMAZING support system from theDogHood community. Join the community at thedoghood.com, join their free FB group and download thedoghood app.   Together, in community we can create a better world for dogs and dog owners. And we are back with Jan Dohner who is giving us such amazing information about Livestock Guardian Dogs. So Jan, you were telling us before the sponsor break, that these dogs really need a special family if you also want them to be a companion dog. So yeah, I wanted to ask, first of all, are these traits bred for Livestock Guardian Dogs? And where do you find a reputable breeder such as yourself? Good question. You do these breeders of Livestock Guardian Dogs are breeding them to have these traits because if there's especially if they're placing them in working homes, which there's a very big demand for working livestock guardians in this country. So you're breeding for these traits, right? For the fact that they are nurturing with small animals you know and gentle with small animals so the fact that they'll be protective that the fact they'll be a self thinker, you know, all these kinds of things. So you know, when people are looking for a working Livestock Guardian Dogs, they need to, like cast their net out and find breeders who are selling to working homes, right? And they also need to do things like ask other people they know that have a successful working Livestock Guardian, where did you get your dog, right? Ask on, you know, livestock and farming groups and lists and your local neighbors and people who stuff too, because you are just like with a good herding dog, you're looking for somebody who's paying attention to those traits. Yeah, and they're all not going to be perfectly successful as a Livestock Guardian, any more than every herding dog puppy is going to be an outstanding herding dog, right? But you really increase your chances by going straight to the source that was somebody breeding for these things. Some of the some breeders of the more popular Livestock Guardian breeds are also breeding for companion homes or for dog showing or activities, you know, and I think of the Great Pyrenees because that's the most popular and well-known dog here. So there are people who are also just breeding for that, right? And so there's a difference, if you're looking for a working dog, you know, you need to look for that kind of breeder. If you're looking for a companion dog, then you need to be doing the things you would do with any good companion dog, you'd be looking for an ethical breeder that, you know, only breeding healthy dogs, breeding dogs with good temperament, you know what I mean? And doing all those kinds of things. So it's the same in that respect. Yeah. And what training is involved? There is some training involved, obviously, first of all, you need to socialize this dog to it just like you would any other dog, right? It needs to be able to go to the veterinarian with you once a year, right? To be able to, to do those basic kinds of things. It needs to have its nails clipped, it needs to be groomed. I mean, there was kind of a myth for a little while in this country that if you had a Livestock Guardian, you should just throw them out in the field and never touch them. never pay any attention to them, they should live with the sheep and not with you. And that's completely wrong. Because as the actual way these dogs lived back in their home countries, was very closely with the shepherd right, this is the person that they were out with months on end. And so the working nature of the dog is not harmed by you building a bond with the dog right and with members of your family building a bond with the dog too. you need to be able to safely handle it and groom it and take it someplace and stuff. So that's the basic stuff. Other than that, what we do is try to make sure that we set the dog up for success when it's a puppy and don't put it in situations where, you know, there could be a catastrophe. In their homelands, most puppies were raised in the, you know, 24/7 care of a shepherd, and maybe his older working livestock dog or dogs, right. So they had mentors around them, and they couldn't get away with bad behavior. Sometimes what we see here is that people have jobs that they're off their farm, or they're away from home, or, you know, and they're not out there with a puppy that might be with a flock of sheep. And they might have lambs, and then they get into trouble because nobody's, you know, guiding them, you know, into proper behavior. So, they need time to grow up too. they need, you know, 1.5 -2 years, in which you need to be supervising them, or only putting them in situations where they'll be okay, right? Like, a friend of mine often says, you don’t put a baby in with a baby to watch a baby, right? So, you know, don’t take a puppy and put it in with those lambs and think that's all going to work out, right? Because the lambs or the baby goats are going to try to play with the puppy. And, you know, so you want the puppy to grow up with some older animals that will sort of teach it to behave, right. A common problem we have is with poultry, because so many people want to keep a Livestock Guardian Dog, because they have, you know, some chickens on their place, right? Or, especially free range. Chickens are not the native, you know, species that these dogs protected in their homelands for all these centuries, right? They were doing sheep and goats and cattle. So chickens are kind of like very flappy, you know, do things that entice play, in lots of young dogs, right. And we're all familiar with the problem with any kind of dog and chickens and, and so I really caution people not to rush at that at all. And you got to give a dog a long time, and you've got to really introduce them to chickens and supervise this. And, you know, because you, you want to have positive experiences as you're building the dog's behaviors, right? And you want to stop anything that's play, and anything that's dangerous and stuff, too. So if there is a little training, it gets easier, actually, once you've raised one Livestock Guardian Dog, because when that dogs grown up, and you bring in another puppy, maybe the older dog can often help train the puppy, right? Like, no, we don't do that here, you know? And I've seen, I've seen that myself, where the older dog says, nope, stop. You know, we don't chase the lambs, right? and stuff. So it gets a little easier. We're kind of in a hybrid situation here in North America, right? We're not full time shepherds. When we can't supervise the growing Livestock Guardian Dog, it needs to be someplace safe, where it can't get in trouble. And where it can't hurt something else, until you've had competence that it's matured. And they can take a while to mature, it can be a year and a half, two years. But you know, I also have always had herding dogs, and you know, you can't do much with them before a couple years old either. They need to learn their basic commands and all kinds of other things to be under, you know, and listen to you before you can take them out to a flock of sheep too. So you just have to be patient. Right? And do they work better in pairs? You mentioned you know, maybe an older dog being the mentor. You know, it depends on each family, they do work in pairs, they are used to working in situations with more than one Livestock Guardian Dog many times two or three or more were kept with big flocks up in the mountains. So they're used to this idea, right? You don't need to get two puppies at the same time, though. And I'm seeing too many people thinking oh, I'm going to get two copies of the same time and raise them and, you know, it's, it's often not a good idea with a companion dog to raise two puppies at the same time. And you're much better off to raise one and then bring in a puppy if you feel like you need two dogs. Or maybe as you know, rescue or adopt an older one, because there are older ones, looking for new homes at times too, right? and then get that dog to listen to your voice and get a puppy. it kind of depends on your needs. If you don't have a lot of heavy predator pressure, just a little bit of predator problem around your you might be just perfectly fine with one, the people who live on larger farms or ranches or have 200 sheep right or something and they're out on you know, 100 acres or something. They're going to need more than one dog because they can't cover that territory and keep everybody safe. Well that was my next question. How many animals can a dog protect at one time? It depends on the area and the kind of terrain you know, like obviously, if you had a 10 acre pasture, it was very flat. A dog or one or two dogs can really keep a good eye on all that right? If you translated that same 10 acres into extremely rolling brushy ground, their line of sight would be you know obstructed all over the place and there'll be all kinds of places where something could you know sneak up on the sheep and so it depends on the terrain. And it depends highly on whether or not you just occasionally have a coyote or a fox that tries to get in your fences, right, or whether you actually have, you know, a coyote pack in your area. And there's multiple coyotes. Because if there's more than one predator, it's not really fair to the dog to have to, you know, face a pack of coyotes or something. you want them to be able to drive it off. And that's what we're looking for is all that bluffing that Livestock Guardian Dogs do they bark, run fiercely at this thing that's coming through the fence, right? And just throw a fit and everything and for the most part warns off, you know, the predator, or they chase it off. So you don't want them out numbered. So it really depends on your, you know, individual situation. Okay? Well, as we're wrapping up, why don't all farmers have these dogs, it makes so much sense. It's an investment in working with another living creature, right? You're you're taking on an animal that you need to build a relationship with, and you need to do training with you need to supervise and you need to enjoy in your life. You need to want this kind of like working relationship. Not everybody, you know, has the time to do that maybe they're not comfortable with large dogs, maybe they're not comfortable with large dominant dogs, which these dogs are, you also need to have good fencing, you know, if you can't keep them on your property, they're a liability to you, you know, you can't have them roaming the neighborhood, you know, where they might, you know, decide that a neighbor's dog is, you know, a danger or something, right. So it's your, it's your responsibility to keep them fenced in. They are enormously popular with the growth that we have seen, especially in the ranching and farming communities, people who raise sheep and goats and cattle. the US government tracks the statistics in agriculture. And over the last 20 years, this has changed from being a minor thing that a few percentage, you know, ranchers do to the second most popular thing that ranchers do to protect their flock. That's great. Yeah, because it is it's a way of coexisting with nature for the most part, right? And it's a way of you not having to physically be present all the time for your flock to be safe, right? and stuff. So but it takes it's a learning curve, and you've got to be willing to put in the time and, you know, so it has really grown now it really has. That's cool. And how much would a dog cost? If it is a dog, that might be a cross between a couple of Livestock Guardian breeds, you don't want a dog that is a cross between a Livestock Guardian breed and some other kind of breed. Unfortunately, there are a lot of people who cross by accident, like their border collie on their farm. That that's, you know, that might be a great companion dog, that's not a good working dog. So if if a dog is unregistered on paper, right like that, that it's just a cross between working dogs. And instead, it could cost you at least maybe $800. If you want a dog from a good breeder who's tested for hips and has registered dogs of a certain breed, that's going to run you more like 1500 up to $2500 or something. And that's an investment in. And one other thing, I guess I just want to mention it, there is a difference between these breeds. We talked about the Great Pyrenees a lot and that is probably the most user friendly for the brand new person new to Livestock Guardians because it's the most people oriented right? And not quite so defensively aggressive. There are other breeds that are far more serious, and they you know, belong in the hands of people who have big ranches out in Wyoming right. Other things are a lot of experience. And so some of those people are looking for a specific kind of breed of dog and that's going to cost you more too because you know you're looking for something that's bred specifically to do something that will help you. Jan this has been such a joy thank you for bringing us this amazing information. I learned so many new things today. Where can everyone find out more information about you and your books on Livestock Guardian Dogs? Everything is on my website and it's JanDohner.com The books are there lots of articles and blog posts and things I've got lots of tips and resources for people trying to use Livestock Guardian Dogs as well which I think will be helpful and useful to people. I've done a number of webinars which are FREE and you know, be a great thing before you buy one. Educate yourself and watch a couple webinars and see how this whole process of training one would be. Well, thank you for all that you do. This is such a great alternative to as you said coexist with nature. So if anybody is interested in learning more again go to Jan's website JanDohner.com. Learn more, it sounds like you have all the information out there. So Jan, thank you. Thank you for being with us today. It was great thanks. Don't forget to join the #1 dog loving community and network at TheDogHood.com and download the smartphone app by dog lovers and for dog lovers. Thanks for listening. You'll find some helpful links in the show notes and if you enjoy the show, please be sure to follow and listen for free on your favorite podcast app. And please, please share your feedback. Visit WagOutLoud.com for great product recommendations with discounts, amazing online events and fantastic resources. That's also where to visit our Bark About It page where you can suggest topics, guests or products. Be advised that this show offers health and nutritional information and is designed for educational purposes only. You're encouraged to do your own research and should not rely on this information as a substitute for nor does it replace professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. If you have any concerns or questions about your dog's health, you should always consult a veterinarian or a nutrition expert. Have a tail wagging day and we'll catch you next time. Hey Winston was that another tail wagging episode?

 Spend Less Time Working, and More Time With Your Dog | File Type: audio/mpeg | Duration: 00:34:07

I’m so excited to be chatting with fellow podcaster and influencer, Tori Mistick, who shares how we can all spend less time working and more time with our dogs. Tori Mistick is an influencer, educator, podcaster and founder of the award-winning dog mom lifestyle brand Wear Wag Repeat. Her mission is to help women live their best life with dogs - as pet parents and petpreneurs! Her dog mom advice has been featured in BuzzFeed, Good Morning America and The Wall Street Journal. There are SO many ways that we can include them in our daily lives, in so many activities and can even travel with them. There is no doubt that Tori will teach you a new way to interact with your dog and she even shares tips on how to start a business or side gig in the pet industry. Our dogs have so much to teach us about life and we should definitely take their cues. Listen in! ❤️

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